I hate “guy trips”

[Anonymous]

You don't hate guy trips you hate that your husband thinks he can opt out of being a dad for a week once home. He's not sick a hangover isn't sick.

[Anonymous]

Sorry it's not working for you. My husband also does a guys trip each year. They get a hotel suite and spend a third of the day doing something active, a third lounging around watching tv, and a third "partying" which it sounds like means sharing two bottles of wine between 4 or 5 guys at the pool or gambling before they're in bed by 1am at the latest.

DH comes home refreshed and jumps right back into life.

[Anonymous]

Working full-time and also doing most of the parenting for three young kids because your spouse is working all the time is really stressful. That is your issue here. If your regular stress level were not already very high, this would feel manageable.

Have you thought about working part time? Can you outsource more? Can he step back? The average family with three young children have parents who are working 40-80 hours a week total, between both parents. You guys are working total of 100-120 hours. That's an entire additional full-time job or two. That's not a good situation for either of you.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Op - what frustrates me is that I am 100% the default parent. I typically do all the drop offs, pick ups, make food, do laundry etc.

But I expect him to help around the house with the kids. Instead he is sleeping until 7:30 (on a week day!) and now will rush to get ready to work and be all stressed because he has so much work to do.

I have been up since 6:30 getting myself ready, lunches, dealing with the dog, getting breakfast and all the kid stuff so they are on time for school.

If you're 100% the default parent, then are you doing anything extra on these mornings? If you are I think you should talk to him about that, but if your day looks no different I don't think it's reasonable to be upset about what he's doing/how stressed he is, because it's not actually affecting you materially.

My wife sleeping to 7:30 while I feed the cat, make lunches, and do school drop off is every morning of my life and it has never occurred to me to be angry at her for sleeping rather than getting up and going to work; I do the same amount of work regardless. I'm fine with the arrangement of responsibilities, which is what matters, not what she's doing with time that I'm doing kid stuff.

Do you know what “default parent” means?

DP it’s a phrase invented by disgruntled women who overestimate their role in their children’s life and are dismissive of the role their partners play, usually a circumstance that is self-inflicted by excessive hectoring, criticism, and micromanagement.

Tell me you’re a lazy parent without telling me you’re a lazy parent.

More original thinking from the “default parent” cliche user. Prattling on about laziness, ironically enough.

from the OP it seems the DH works 60-80 hours per week including nights and weekends. I would also assume his busy schedule does not allow for him to cover sick days or school closures but OP can correct me if wrong. There are 168 hours in a week. 80 means he is working 50% of the available hours of the week. 6 hours of sleep means 42 hours. An hour to get ready and commute in the morning plus min 30 commute home= 7.5 hours minimum, if he is not commuting into work on weekends. So just with working, sleeping minimum suggested amount, and commuting he takes 130 hours per week leaving 38 hours spread over 7 days is 5.5 hours to eat, workout, spend time with your family/spouse, run errands, cook dinners, etc.

On working hours alone, OP has 40 more hours per week to dedicate to her family and home. So yes she is the default parent, default cleaner, default sports driver, default grocery shopper, default sick day coverer.

as far as salary goes, OP DH better be making 2x the amount of money minimum.

Op - yes you pretty much have it spot on.

And yes he makes about 3.5-4 times what I make.

So the guy works 50-10% more than you and makes 350-400% more than you, and two weeks of inconvenience per year is causing you to build up resentment and might result in a serious talk about his behavior? How selfish. That sounds really spoiled.

As someone with a spouse who works a lot, I really hate this attitude. Just because my husband makes a ton of money doesn't mean he gets to have more rest than I do.

But OP's husband works a lot more than she does, and most likely at a more stressful job (stress tends to come with higher hours and pay, though not always).

If she's default parent for three young kids, he doesn't work more than she does. He works *for pay* more than she does. They should both have equivalent downtime, which she's not getting in the week after his guys' trip because he's working even more at his job, and even less around the house, after doing nothing for either while gone. So yes, she does get to complain. How much she should complain I think comes down to what kind of partner/father he is the other 50 weeks out of the year, but this persistent DCUM trope that if a guy earns enough money he is entitled to treat his family like servants is gross.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Op - what frustrates me is that I am 100% the default parent. I typically do all the drop offs, pick ups, make food, do laundry etc.

But I expect him to help around the house with the kids. Instead he is sleeping until 7:30 (on a week day!) and now will rush to get ready to work and be all stressed because he has so much work to do.

I have been up since 6:30 getting myself ready, lunches, dealing with the dog, getting breakfast and all the kid stuff so they are on time for school.

If you're 100% the default parent, then are you doing anything extra on these mornings? If you are I think you should talk to him about that, but if your day looks no different I don't think it's reasonable to be upset about what he's doing/how stressed he is, because it's not actually affecting you materially.

My wife sleeping to 7:30 while I feed the cat, make lunches, and do school drop off is every morning of my life and it has never occurred to me to be angry at her for sleeping rather than getting up and going to work; I do the same amount of work regardless. I'm fine with the arrangement of responsibilities, which is what matters, not what she's doing with time that I'm doing kid stuff.

Do you know what “default parent” means?

DP it’s a phrase invented by disgruntled women who overestimate their role in their children’s life and are dismissive of the role their partners play, usually a circumstance that is self-inflicted by excessive hectoring, criticism, and micromanagement.

Tell me you’re a lazy parent without telling me you’re a lazy parent.

More original thinking from the “default parent” cliche user. Prattling on about laziness, ironically enough.

from the OP it seems the DH works 60-80 hours per week including nights and weekends. I would also assume his busy schedule does not allow for him to cover sick days or school closures but OP can correct me if wrong. There are 168 hours in a week. 80 means he is working 50% of the available hours of the week. 6 hours of sleep means 42 hours. An hour to get ready and commute in the morning plus min 30 commute home= 7.5 hours minimum, if he is not commuting into work on weekends. So just with working, sleeping minimum suggested amount, and commuting he takes 130 hours per week leaving 38 hours spread over 7 days is 5.5 hours to eat, workout, spend time with your family/spouse, run errands, cook dinners, etc.

On working hours alone, OP has 40 more hours per week to dedicate to her family and home. So yes she is the default parent, default cleaner, default sports driver, default grocery shopper, default sick day coverer.

as far as salary goes, OP DH better be making 2x the amount of money minimum.

Op - yes you pretty much have it spot on.

And yes he makes about 3.5-4 times what I make.

So the guy works 50-10% more than you and makes 350-400% more than you, and two weeks of inconvenience per year is causing you to build up resentment and might result in a serious talk about his behavior? How selfish. That sounds really spoiled.

As someone with a spouse who works a lot, I really hate this attitude. Just because my husband makes a ton of money doesn't mean he gets to have more rest than I do.

But OP's husband works a lot more than she does, and most likely at a more stressful job (stress tends to come with higher hours and pay, though not always).

If she's default parent for three young kids, he doesn't work more than she does. He works *for pay* more than she does. They should both have equivalent downtime, which she's not getting in the week after his guys' trip because he's working even more at his job, and even less around the house, after doing nothing for either while gone. So yes, she does get to complain. How much she should complain I think comes down to what kind of partner/father he is the other 50 weeks out of the year, but this persistent DCUM trope that if a guy earns enough money he is entitled to treat his family like servants is gross.

Sorry, if you think that working at a 40 hour/wk job and being default parent for three school aged kids is the same amount of work and stress as working 60-80 hours a week at a high-paying (and likely high stress) job, then you have no idea what it's like to actually work a job like that.

And again, it is two weeks out of a year.

[Anonymous]

Weird. My husband goes on guys trips and I'm always glad when he does. He comes home tired (as do I when I go on girls trips!) but he doesn't do any less when he gets home.

You complain about having to do everything 24/7. Come on. It's a few days (my husband has gone to Europe for a whole week with his friends before) so suck it up. I assume you do the same? If not, why not?

Also, why is missing out on work after not having worked over the weekend? Does he always work weekends? If so then he should plan better.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Op - what frustrates me is that I am 100% the default parent. I typically do all the drop offs, pick ups, make food, do laundry etc.

But I expect him to help around the house with the kids. Instead he is sleeping until 7:30 (on a week day!) and now will rush to get ready to work and be all stressed because he has so much work to do.

I have been up since 6:30 getting myself ready, lunches, dealing with the dog, getting breakfast and all the kid stuff so they are on time for school.

So fix this part. The guys' trip is not the problem here...

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Op - what frustrates me is that I am 100% the default parent. I typically do all the drop offs, pick ups, make food, do laundry etc.

But I expect him to help around the house with the kids. Instead he is sleeping until 7:30 (on a week day!) and now will rush to get ready to work and be all stressed because he has so much work to do.

I have been up since 6:30 getting myself ready, lunches, dealing with the dog, getting breakfast and all the kid stuff so they are on time for school.

If you're 100% the default parent, then are you doing anything extra on these mornings? If you are I think you should talk to him about that, but if your day looks no different I don't think it's reasonable to be upset about what he's doing/how stressed he is, because it's not actually affecting you materially.

My wife sleeping to 7:30 while I feed the cat, make lunches, and do school drop off is every morning of my life and it has never occurred to me to be angry at her for sleeping rather than getting up and going to work; I do the same amount of work regardless. I'm fine with the arrangement of responsibilities, which is what matters, not what she's doing with time that I'm doing kid stuff.

Do you know what “default parent” means?

DP it’s a phrase invented by disgruntled women who overestimate their role in their children’s life and are dismissive of the role their partners play, usually a circumstance that is self-inflicted by excessive hectoring, criticism, and micromanagement.

Tell me you’re a lazy parent without telling me you’re a lazy parent.

More original thinking from the “default parent” cliche user. Prattling on about laziness, ironically enough.

from the OP it seems the DH works 60-80 hours per week including nights and weekends. I would also assume his busy schedule does not allow for him to cover sick days or school closures but OP can correct me if wrong. There are 168 hours in a week. 80 means he is working 50% of the available hours of the week. 6 hours of sleep means 42 hours. An hour to get ready and commute in the morning plus min 30 commute home= 7.5 hours minimum, if he is not commuting into work on weekends. So just with working, sleeping minimum suggested amount, and commuting he takes 130 hours per week leaving 38 hours spread over 7 days is 5.5 hours to eat, workout, spend time with your family/spouse, run errands, cook dinners, etc.

On working hours alone, OP has 40 more hours per week to dedicate to her family and home. So yes she is the default parent, default cleaner, default sports driver, default grocery shopper, default sick day coverer.

as far as salary goes, OP DH better be making 2x the amount of money minimum.

Op - yes you pretty much have it spot on.

And yes he makes about 3.5-4 times what I make.

So the guy works 50-10% more than you and makes 350-400% more than you, and two weeks of inconvenience per year is causing you to build up resentment and might result in a serious talk about his behavior? How selfish. That sounds really spoiled.

As someone with a spouse who works a lot, I really hate this attitude. Just because my husband makes a ton of money doesn't mean he gets to have more rest than I do.

But OP's husband works a lot more than she does, and most likely at a more stressful job (stress tends to come with higher hours and pay, though not always).

If she's default parent for three young kids, he doesn't work more than she does. He works *for pay* more than she does. They should both have equivalent downtime, which she's not getting in the week after his guys' trip because he's working even more at his job, and even less around the house, after doing nothing for either while gone. So yes, she does get to complain. How much she should complain I think comes down to what kind of partner/father he is the other 50 weeks out of the year, but this persistent DCUM trope that if a guy earns enough money he is entitled to treat his family like servants is gross.

Sorry, if you think that working at a 40 hour/wk job and being default parent for three school aged kids is the same amount of work and stress as working 60-80 hours a week at a high-paying (and likely high stress) job, then you have no idea what it's like to actually work a job like that.

And again, it is two weeks out of a year.

have you been the default parent to three kids with a spouse who is working 60-80 hours a week? I’m guessing you have no idea what that’s like. In fact, it’s probably that very few people have had both experiences so you cant just ask for anecdotes to see which one is harder.

You can keep track of work hours and downtime, though. I did that once at the recommendation of my therapist and it was very enlightening. On average, I put in as many hours as my big law husband. It made me feel better about taking breaks.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Maybe you could offer to plan/review the activities so that the re-entry goes smoother? More hikes and museums and fewer casino nights (for example). I’m sure the other wives aren’t thrilled either and would be happy to help. Yes, more work on the front end, but a better overall result.

This is quite possibly the most ridiculous post I've ever seen.

First - what man wants his wife planning his weekend away with his friends? I don't want my husband planning my weekends away! (Also, what man wants to spend his weekend with his friends at a museum?!?).

Second - I doubt the other wives would appreciate it because their husbands might not be this useless (mine sure isn't when he comes home from a weekend with his friends). Then they'd just have to listen to their husbands complain how they had to go visit an art exhibit instead of playing golf.

Third - why should OP, who is already doing all the work while her husband is gone, do any work in order to plan his trip for him? He needs to do better!

I have a feeling that this response was written by ChatGPT. Or an alien. Not a real person with any actual life experience for sure.

[Anonymous]

I go on a couple guy's trips per year; my wife goes on a couple girl's trips each year. We both drink on the trips, and they are not spent at art museums. We both are tired when we get back, and maybe sleep in a little the first day back. But none of us ever ignore our responsibilities for several days afterwards.

Predictably, this thread has brought out the DCUM crazies/alarmists - he's cheating, don't let him go anymore, he has a drinking problem, "I don't go on these trips and if you do than your marriage is in trouble," etc. In reality, this "issue," such as it is, requires a couple of respectful conversations (and I don't believe Op has said that she actually talked with her husband, or what his response was).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think a lot of you guys are missing that he’s also getting behind at work from these trips. My husband works a ton and works most weekends. Even 4 days visiting family he has to work or he’s stressed out and annoying for a week or more after. If he was gone drinking for 4 days and came back complaining about all the work he was behind on I would find that very annoying. I 100 percent believe that he’s unhelpful and difficult to be around for quite a few days after.

I think he’s entitled to see his friends but he’s not entitled to minimize how it affects you. I don’t have concrete suggestions about what to do (although I personally would just rather have my house in a hotel for an extra day rather than listening to any complaining - I actually encourage my husband to do similar things when he’s traveling for work) but I understand, OP. I feel these situations really emphasize to me how tightly stretched we are all the time and I wish my husband would agree and be open to making changes. But when you handle all the fall out (which I would rather do than make my kids handle it because when my husband is stressed he yells more than I’m ok with) and they refuse to change it’s very hard.

OP - I feel heard and seen with this post. This is exactly the problem with my DH. He too works 60-80 hours a week, including the weekends. When he takes time away its always a HUGE problem. He took a few calls while we was gone on his trip but obviously did not work his normal hours while gone.

So he’s working on the weekends anyway and not around typically to help? So there’s not much difference in your solo parenting if he goes away than if he stays at home working all weekend?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My husband and I never did 'guy' or 'girl' trips. We are early 50s. We did do a lot of trips with other couples and also trips in larger friend groups.

They were never segregated by gender trips. My parents were the same. My mom and dad never did alone trips. They also traveled a lot by themselves or with their big group of couple friends.

I really have seen some bad sh*t come out of these single gender trips over the years. Cheating, etc.

Cool story, Jan. Every single friend I can think of, male or female, does trips with their friends. No cheating scandals I've ever heard of. Sorry you've missed out.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My husband and I never did 'guy' or 'girl' trips. We are early 50s. We did do a lot of trips with other couples and also trips in larger friend groups.

They were never segregated by gender trips. My parents were the same. My mom and dad never did alone trips. They also traveled a lot by themselves or with their big group of couple friends.

I really have seen some bad sh*t come out of these single gender trips over the years. Cheating, etc.

Op - my parents never did alone trips either but they also didn’t have their OWN friends. Only couple friends. I think it’s a generational thing.

We are all in our late 30s/early 40s. We have our own friends from high school, college, work, etc. I think it’s very important that we maintain these ties and have time to strengthen these relationships.

With young kids it’s hard to find someone to watch them if we are both gone. So we each get a trip away with friends and then once a year we have grandparents watch kids so we can do a couples trip.

Again it’s not the trip itself that annoys me. It’s the coming home and being tired/hungover, etc that I find annoying.

My parents definitely took trips without each other. Usually with a group, although sometimes my mom would go to a retreat at a monastery in Santa Barbara where they wouldn't talk for the whole week. I didn't get that as a kid but I sure do now!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I go on a couple guy's trips per year; my wife goes on a couple girl's trips each year. We both drink on the trips, and they are not spent at art museums. We both are tired when we get back, and maybe sleep in a little the first day back. But none of us ever ignore our responsibilities for several days afterwards.

Predictably, this thread has brought out the DCUM crazies/alarmists - he's cheating, don't let him go anymore, he has a drinking problem, "I don't go on these trips and if you do than your marriage is in trouble," etc. In reality, this "issue," such as it is, requires a couple of respectful conversations (and I don't believe Op has said that she actually talked with her husband, or what his response was).

+1

The issue isn't the trip.
The issue isn't the drinking.

The issue is that OP feels like he shirks responsibilities for days? (I don't think OP has responded to questions to be more specific on this- whether this was the first morning back or more.) after.

The answer is to have a conversation with him- a clam non-accusatory conversation.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I would ask that he stay elsewhere for his recovery day and count that as a vacation day. For the PP who suggested that was toxic bean counting, I disagree. The idea of stepping away from my family for a long weekend to go have fun and leave DH with all the childcare duties is a big deal. I've done it a few times but it's not something we just do, and every day really does count. Seems a lot less toxic to call it a 4-day trip instead of a 3-day trip, and avoid the resentment over that final day. Then when the wife is considering her trip she doesn't have to feel bad or guilty taking the extra day also.

My husband and I both take trips with our friends. We don't count how many days we are each gone, we just support each other's trips. Some years I'm gone more than he is, some years he's gone more than I am. Sometimes one of us travels farther or to a more expensive location than the other. We don't keep a tally of all that. That's the part that becomes bean counting.