How are these nepo babies in these summer finance internships able to keep up with the work

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I can’t imagine being actually wealthy and wanting to go into….banking?

I did IB out of college but I was an UMC striver.

No way if I had a trust fund would I have ever considered such a ridiculous job. Spending hours in PowerPoint and excel and hours with nothing to do while you wait for feedback on a pitchbook.

Haha. So true. In fact after a 20 year lucrative career in finance, I am now back at school to get a degree in social work bc I now can afford a low paying but much more rewarding job.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I feel like nowadays this topic is a bit more nuanced. At top banks it’s very hard to schmooze a way in without also being a high performer. Case in point: on Goldman Sachs’ website their global head of investment banking is Dan Dees. It looks like he went to Duke and his daughter just graduated from Duke too, and shocker, she’s going to be working as an investment banker at Goldman. However, it looks like she graduated from her elite private HS in cum laude society so she’s no pushover academically. I suspect this is more the case nowadays; at the very least these parents feel like their kid should be able to back up their spot that they’ll eventually get through family connections.

The dad is the global head of investment banking, what do you expect? The connection can’t get much better, of course they’ll take her in. And she has a Duke degree to boot so no one will bat an eye

Did you miss the part where she graduate in the cum laude society at Harvard-Westlake? She's clearly a hard worker, she probably wouldn't need Dad's influence to land a role like that regardless.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I feel like nowadays this topic is a bit more nuanced. At top banks it’s very hard to schmooze a way in without also being a high performer. Case in point: on Goldman Sachs’ website their global head of investment banking is Dan Dees. It looks like he went to Duke and his daughter just graduated from Duke too, and shocker, she’s going to be working as an investment banker at Goldman. However, it looks like she graduated from her elite private HS in cum laude society so she’s no pushover academically. I suspect this is more the case nowadays; at the very least these parents feel like their kid should be able to back up their spot that they’ll eventually get through family connections.

The dad is the global head of investment banking, what do you expect? The connection can’t get much better, of course they’ll take her in. And she has a Duke degree to boot so no one will bat an eye

Did you miss the part where she graduate in the cum laude society at Harvard-Westlake? She's clearly a hard worker, she probably wouldn't need Dad's influence to land a role like that regardless.

No one will ever know because he had that influence. That’s the beauty of modern nepotism- so many of these kids are qualified, that the excuse works. We just ignored that dozens of more qualified kids and hundreds of equally qualified kids were passed over in their favor

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I feel like nowadays this topic is a bit more nuanced. At top banks it’s very hard to schmooze a way in without also being a high performer. Case in point: on Goldman Sachs’ website their global head of investment banking is Dan Dees. It looks like he went to Duke and his daughter just graduated from Duke too, and shocker, she’s going to be working as an investment banker at Goldman. However, it looks like she graduated from her elite private HS in cum laude society so she’s no pushover academically. I suspect this is more the case nowadays; at the very least these parents feel like their kid should be able to back up their spot that they’ll eventually get through family connections.

The dad is the global head of investment banking, what do you expect? The connection can’t get much better, of course they’ll take her in. And she has a Duke degree to boot so no one will bat an eye

Did you miss the part where she graduate in the cum laude society at Harvard-Westlake? She's clearly a hard worker, she probably wouldn't need Dad's influence to land a role like that regardless.

No one will ever know because he had that influence. That’s the beauty of modern nepotism- so many of these kids are qualified, that the excuse works. We just ignored that dozens of more qualified kids and hundreds of equally qualified kids were passed over in their favor

It's better than the flavor of nepotism where most of the people were not remotely qualified. Like was stated, at least this girl was in the cum laude society (top 10%) at Harvard-Westlake which is the best prep school in California, so that's a notable accomplishment and shows she has academic chops. And she went to Duke so she at least had to compete with bright students in her classes, although it doesn't seem like she made Latin Honors at Duke which is fair since Duke would be much harder.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP you are missing the point of how these jobs are hired and what traits make good bankers. I worked in banking on wall at for years and was involved in the analyst (summer and full-time) hiring process. Good resumes and GPAs were a dime a dozen. We tossed more 4.0a than we chose to move to the second round. For the most part anyone can do the actual analyst work. The training is rigorous enough that it can all be learned. What we couldn’t teach were social skills, drive, and stamina. Even the interns can end up on a project with tight deadlines and long, long hours. Do we want the whiney kid who can’t function on little sleep? Or do we want the athlete who in the interview talks about two a day practices and powering through something on little sleep? The teams on these projects are often little so even the intern analyst will have contact with senior people (think CEOs, CFOs, etc at clients where it has taken years to build relationships). You are seeing these kids as just connected frat brothers. In interviews they were generally the ones who were most comfortable and good in any type of situation. Why do you think we often did an interview over a meal? We wanted to see what these candidates would be like in any type of situation. I’d hire the 3.0 who was flexible in any situation over the rigid 4.0 who had spent all of her time studying anyway. On the surface I’m sure some of the groups looked like they had unfair hiring but current hires got input and of course they would vouch for the kid they knew from their lacrosse team if they knew he had the stamina and personality they wanted vs an unknown. Bonuses are dependent on the group revenue. Good junior hires also lighten the load for everyone in the group.

We did hire many first generation immigrants. Who we did not generally hire were the kids where we had not heard their names or anything other than seeing them on a stack of summer intern applications. You would be surprised how (appropriately) aggressive some of these kids were in applying. Personalized emails, letters and calls to everyone on the group they wanted to work in. Sample pitches tailored specifically to an MD in a group. Letters commenting on recent transactions with ideas of add-one to pursue. These kids generally would go to their career center and filter out all of the alums in their specific finance roll they wanted and then send specific emails. They’d look up what their majors were or fraternities or sports. Then send a tailored letter that i, too, am in xyz the same as you. I am going to be in nyc the week of x. Would you have time for an informational interview, etc. These are the kids who know how to pursue a goal and are hired.
I am not saying your child didn’t do all of this, but you sound bitter and don’t seem to have things to back it up. I’d look at how far your child got in the process. Did he make it to the first round of interviews? If not then he didn’t pursue applying hard enough. Did he get a bunch of first rounds and go no further? Ok then he needs to rethink how he interviews. Did he make it past the phone interviews and no offers after in person? Dissect it like that.

We did hire from European universities, although most applied to London over nyc. We had analysts from trinity, ucd, etc. The issue is a lot of them didn’t have the social skills that made them good front office candidates. Most weren’t given full time offers. One went on to be very successful, but he was the exception. Many went on to do more back office, accounting type rolls.

This OP is important for you to understand. Yes there will always be nepo hires on Wall Street but that doesn't mean the entire class of IB analysts are all nepo hires. My roommate, husband and brother were all IB analysts and none of them got it with just a handshake and a wink. My husband was a 3.9 in engineering from a top state school (by cramming the night before exams) and just does case study interviews for fun. My brother networked all through college, did research in biomedical engineering and was president of his fraternity. Completing two years at a top IB program opens doors at hedge funds, PE firms, strategy roles at top startups, roles at FAANG companies so it's extremely competitive. Just having a high GPA is only one piece of getting an offer.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
"Local elites" still control this country once you get outside the 5-7 largest metro areas. And that's where frat boys thrive - mortgage banking, commercial RE, regional law firms, sales jobs, etc.

It's all about where you play golf, who knew in Sigma Nu, which Big 10 team you supporter, etc. Guys in company branded polo shirts sitting in domestic 1st class on the flight from Chicago to Des Moines.

This is accurate. I played D1 golf at a SEC school and play golf with people in the office where I work. We had a company retreat at a golf country club and I beat everyone in golf, including the CEO. He was so impressed that he invited me to play with him regularly at Congressional CC. I also play regularly with the CFO at Riverbend CC in Great Falls as an invited guest. I recently got promoted to VP position not because I am better than other candidates but because they know me better on a personal level. It is all about networking and relationship. You are kidding yourself if you think otherwise.

I can't even possibly imagine what an enormous asset this is in the corporate networking world. Better than any degree I can imagine (and I say this as someone with two Harvard degrees!)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
"Local elites" still control this country once you get outside the 5-7 largest metro areas. And that's where frat boys thrive - mortgage banking, commercial RE, regional law firms, sales jobs, etc.

It's all about where you play golf, who knew in Sigma Nu, which Big 10 team you supporter, etc. Guys in company branded polo shirts sitting in domestic 1st class on the flight from Chicago to Des Moines.

This is accurate. I played D1 golf at a SEC school and play golf with people in the office where I work. We had a company retreat at a golf country club and I beat everyone in golf, including the CEO. He was so impressed that he invited me to play with him regularly at Congressional CC. I also play regularly with the CFO at Riverbend CC in Great Falls as an invited guest. I recently got promoted to VP position not because I am better than other candidates but because they know me better on a personal level. It is all about networking and relationship. You are kidding yourself if you think otherwise.

I can't even possibly imagine what an enormous asset this is in the corporate networking world. Better than any degree I can imagine (and I say this as someone with two Harvard degrees!)

+1 in an industry of relations and likability, sports can be a huge plus and way to bond. Particularly Golf, squash, tennis, polo, and basketball.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Anyone can do one of these jobs. It doesn’t take a lot of intelligence to understand financial markets and work on PowerPoints. I once was an intern. It’s kind of like how there are millions of kids who would do perfectly fine at Princeton.

The ones who don’t have what it takes won’t get offers after the summer.

The bolder part is 100% true. It’s not rocket science.

If this site is to believed, understanding financial markets and instruments doesn’t go beyond buying a couple of Vanguard Index funds and holding onto them until death

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote: It makes me feel like I'm wasting my money on bucknell as these schools only pay off if you have prior family wealth and connections to launch your career in investment banking and finance.

Well yes, that’s why regardless of how much this forum preens about SLACs, they are useless for most middle class families. These schools are too small and too far away from metro areas to attract any interest from major employers.

If you wanted a more meritocratic recruitment process, you’d have your son do engineering at a major state school.

Meh. We’re middle class and our kids aren’t obsessed with being business bros. An LAC will serve them fine to do what they want to do.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Really frustrates me as DS is very hard working and going into senior year at Bucknell. Many of his classmates with loaded parents with connections on Wall Street have gotten their kids internships for the summer at companies like JP Morgan, Morgan Stanley, even Goldman Sachs. Kid feels discouraged. He has a 3.8 gpa, good extracurriculars but got shunned away in favor of kids whose dad golfs with the vp of wealth management and has a 3.0 gpa and subpar involvement in college besides frats. It makes me feel like I'm wasting my money on bucknell as these schools only pay off if you have prior family wealth and connections to launch your career in investment banking and finance. Also, how are these kids who barely ut the work in during the school year manage to work these long, long hours in these internships? Are these repo babies given a pass if daddy is there at work today supervising?

This story is just not true. Each of those firms have internship programs and you can’t get one of those jobs through connections of parents. The school maybe but not parents. Those firms got in trouble for doing stuff like you suggest outside the US. When that happened they revamped the programs. No one is getting a job at Goldman because of parent connections. That is the past.

No but Goldman daddy is hiring JP daddy’s kid and vice versa.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
"Local elites" still control this country once you get outside the 5-7 largest metro areas. And that's where frat boys thrive - mortgage banking, commercial RE, regional law firms, sales jobs, etc.

It's all about where you play golf, who knew in Sigma Nu, which Big 10 team you supporter, etc. Guys in company branded polo shirts sitting in domestic 1st class on the flight from Chicago to Des Moines.

This is accurate. I played D1 golf at a SEC school and play golf with people in the office where I work. We had a company retreat at a golf country club and I beat everyone in golf, including the CEO. He was so impressed that he invited me to play with him regularly at Congressional CC. I also play regularly with the CFO at Riverbend CC in Great Falls as an invited guest. I recently got promoted to VP position not because I am better than other candidates but because they know me better on a personal level. It is all about networking and relationship. You are kidding yourself if you think otherwise.

I can't even possibly imagine what an enormous asset this is in the corporate networking world. Better than any degree I can imagine (and I say this as someone with two Harvard degrees!)

+1 in an industry of relations and likability, sports can be a huge plus and way to bond. Particularly Golf, squash, tennis, polo, and basketball.

Being good at poker is also a plus

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Really frustrates me as DS is very hard working and going into senior year at Bucknell. Many of his classmates with loaded parents with connections on Wall Street have gotten their kids internships for the summer at companies like JP Morgan, Morgan Stanley, even Goldman Sachs. Kid feels discouraged. He has a 3.8 gpa, good extracurriculars but got shunned away in favor of kids whose dad golfs with the vp of wealth management and has a 3.0 gpa and subpar involvement in college besides frats. It makes me feel like I'm wasting my money on bucknell as these schools only pay off if you have prior family wealth and connections to launch your career in investment banking and finance. Also, how are these kids who barely ut the work in during the school year manage to work these long, long hours in these internships? Are these repo babies given a pass if daddy is there at work today supervising?

The problem is your son didn’t understand the point of attending Bucknell…it’s not to get a 3.8 (but that’s great)…it’s to become friends with the rich kids you lament…and get hooked up with a job.

Yup

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Really frustrates me as DS is very hard working and going into senior year at Bucknell. Many of his classmates with loaded parents with connections on Wall Street have gotten their kids internships for the summer at companies like JP Morgan, Morgan Stanley, even Goldman Sachs. Kid feels discouraged. He has a 3.8 gpa, good extracurriculars but got shunned away in favor of kids whose dad golfs with the vp of wealth management and has a 3.0 gpa and subpar involvement in college besides frats. It makes me feel like I'm wasting my money on bucknell as these schools only pay off if you have prior family wealth and connections to launch your career in investment banking and finance. Also, how are these kids who barely ut the work in during the school year manage to work these long, long hours in these internships? Are these repo babies given a pass if daddy is there at work today supervising?

It does not matter what you know, but who.

[Anonymous]

Why do people assume that kids with very successful parents or legacies are stupid? They have high IQ parents and are raised from birth surrounded by books, private schools, exposure to intellectual conversations at the dinner table, world travel, etc. Strivers think these kids are idiots or getting a 1350 on their SAT.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Why do people assume that kids with very successful parents or legacies are stupid? They have high IQ parents and are raised from birth surrounded by books, private schools, exposure to intellectual conversations at the dinner table, world travel, etc. Strivers think these kids are idiots or getting a 1350 on their SAT.

The strivers have a desperate need to believe they have more merit than the legacies, it’s central to their personal narrative. Unfortunately for the strivers they’ll never actually fit in.