IB Diploma Success Stories?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You also have to realize that IB will slow down the most advanced kids. You are limited in the number of HL classes and IB is limited to the last two years of high school. My most advanced kid chose AP instead of IB at one of MCPS’ school IB programs. The key was that she has AP classes in all areas - English, Calculus, History, Govt, Sci, Foreign Language.

They really limit the number of HLs you can take? Or are you saying there just isn't a way to fit in as many as a kid would want becuase each takes 2 years?

"Each student takes at least three (but not more than four) subjects at higher level, and the remaining at standard level."

https://www.ibo.org/university-admission/support-students-transition-to-higher-education/course-selection-guidance/

This is the issue with IB. Top students will take about 15 AP’s, while IB students take at most 4 high level (HL). For the extended essay, AP also has the diploma program with AP Research and AP Seminar. Few high schools offer it, but there’s also the option for online. IB is less flexible and in my view not the best choice for the top student.

IB is 11th grade and 12th grade only. During 9th grade and 10th grade, "top students" take APs. In addition, universities give credit for IB SL classes as well as IB HL classes. For example, University of Maryland College Park: https://www.transfercredit.umd.edu/plc/IBGenEd.pdf

Not sure you actually read the link you posted. Take math for example, it only gives credit for HL for Calculus I and Statistics 100, no credit for SL. The distribution of APs is not the same over all high school years. Often strong students take 10 APs in 11th and 12th, compared to 4 HL for IB. It is still in favor of AP. You can do a combination of IB and AP but it just highlights that IB is not that great of a program on its own.

There are a lot of other SL classes that UMD does give credit for. Math is not everything. Plus if you're a math person, you're taking HL, not SL.

Are AP and IB the same? No, but then nobody said they are. HL classes are two-year classes, so yes, if your goal is to have the largest number of tests, then you should do AP, not IB.

Right. It all depends on the student/family's goals.

If the student's priority is to rack up as many college credits while staying in the school building, then AP makes sense.

If the student's priority is to rack up the maximum number of college credits that are more likely to transfer AND they want to get out of their high school building, than dual enrollment makes sense.

If the student's priority is to take on course work that mimics college in terms of demanding writing, research and expression of thought, than IB is the best as that seems to really prepare students best for the 4-year college expectations, with the bonus of being transferrable especially if the student is interested in international study.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You also have to realize that IB will slow down the most advanced kids. You are limited in the number of HL classes and IB is limited to the last two years of high school. My most advanced kid chose AP instead of IB at one of MCPS’ school IB programs. The key was that she has AP classes in all areas - English, Calculus, History, Govt, Sci, Foreign Language.

They really limit the number of HLs you can take? Or are you saying there just isn't a way to fit in as many as a kid would want becuase each takes 2 years?

"Each student takes at least three (but not more than four) subjects at higher level, and the remaining at standard level."

https://www.ibo.org/university-admission/support-students-transition-to-higher-education/course-selection-guidance/

This is the issue with IB. Top students will take about 15 AP’s, while IB students take at most 4 high level (HL). For the extended essay, AP also has the diploma program with AP Research and AP Seminar. Few high schools offer it, but there’s also the option for online. IB is less flexible and in my view not the best choice for the top student.

IB is 11th grade and 12th grade only. During 9th grade and 10th grade, "top students" take APs. In addition, universities give credit for IB SL classes as well as IB HL classes. For example, University of Maryland College Park: https://www.transfercredit.umd.edu/plc/IBGenEd.pdf

Not sure you actually read the link you posted. Take math for example, it only gives credit for HL for Calculus I and Statistics 100, no credit for SL. The distribution of APs is not the same over all high school years. Often strong students take 10 APs in 11th and 12th, compared to 4 HL for IB. It is still in favor of AP. You can do a combination of IB and AP but it just highlights that IB is not that great of a program on its own.

There are a lot of other SL classes that UMD does give credit for. Math is not everything. Plus if you're a math person, you're taking HL, not SL.

Are AP and IB the same? No, but then nobody said they are. HL classes are two-year classes, so yes, if your goal is to have the largest number of tests, then you should do AP, not IB.

What is in your view the advantages of IB over AP, if ‘number of tests’ is not something you’d consider?

Take sciences for example. Physics, Biology, Computer Science, no credit for SL. Chemistry gets credit for SL. For a STEM oriented student IB makes less sense than AP. From the list you gave, there’s more credit if you’re leaning towards humanities, but most universities give less. The norm is not getting credit for SL, but I’m sure you already know this.

You can argue that the credit universities are giving for these classes is a measure of the strength of the program. The goal is to take the most rigorous coursework while maintaining good grades. IB puts a ceiling on that most rigorous, at least for STEM.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You also have to realize that IB will slow down the most advanced kids. You are limited in the number of HL classes and IB is limited to the last two years of high school. My most advanced kid chose AP instead of IB at one of MCPS’ school IB programs. The key was that she has AP classes in all areas - English, Calculus, History, Govt, Sci, Foreign Language.

They really limit the number of HLs you can take? Or are you saying there just isn't a way to fit in as many as a kid would want becuase each takes 2 years?

"Each student takes at least three (but not more than four) subjects at higher level, and the remaining at standard level."

https://www.ibo.org/university-admission/support-students-transition-to-higher-education/course-selection-guidance/

This is the issue with IB. Top students will take about 15 AP’s, while IB students take at most 4 high level (HL). For the extended essay, AP also has the diploma program with AP Research and AP Seminar. Few high schools offer it, but there’s also the option for online. IB is less flexible and in my view not the best choice for the top student.

IB is 11th grade and 12th grade only. During 9th grade and 10th grade, "top students" take APs. In addition, universities give credit for IB SL classes as well as IB HL classes. For example, University of Maryland College Park: https://www.transfercredit.umd.edu/plc/IBGenEd.pdf

Not sure you actually read the link you posted. Take math for example, it only gives credit for HL for Calculus I and Statistics 100, no credit for SL. The distribution of APs is not the same over all high school years. Often strong students take 10 APs in 11th and 12th, compared to 4 HL for IB. It is still in favor of AP. You can do a combination of IB and AP but it just highlights that IB is not that great of a program on its own.

There are a lot of other SL classes that UMD does give credit for. Math is not everything. Plus if you're a math person, you're taking HL, not SL.

Are AP and IB the same? No, but then nobody said they are. HL classes are two-year classes, so yes, if your goal is to have the largest number of tests, then you should do AP, not IB.

Right. It all depends on the student/family's goals.

If the student's priority is to rack up as many college credits while staying in the school building, then AP makes sense.

If the student's priority is to rack up the maximum number of college credits that are more likely to transfer AND they want to get out of their high school building, than dual enrollment makes sense.

If the student's priority is to take on course work that mimics college in terms of demanding writing, research and expression of thought, than IB is the best as that seems to really prepare students best for the 4-year college expectations, with the bonus of being transferrable especially if the student is interested in international study.

Genuinely interested in knowing what evidence you have for the bolder, besides anecdotal stories. You hear that all the time from proponents of IB, but I’m not sure it’s that clear cut.

AP English Lang and Lit, all History, AP Capstone etc, they all are very demanding in terms of writing, critical thinking etc. can you honestly say they are less demanding than IB?

I don’t want to generalize, but an International studies major is just too narrow and it sounds like one of those useless degrees.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You also have to realize that IB will slow down the most advanced kids. You are limited in the number of HL classes and IB is limited to the last two years of high school. My most advanced kid chose AP instead of IB at one of MCPS’ school IB programs. The key was that she has AP classes in all areas - English, Calculus, History, Govt, Sci, Foreign Language.

They really limit the number of HLs you can take? Or are you saying there just isn't a way to fit in as many as a kid would want becuase each takes 2 years?

"Each student takes at least three (but not more than four) subjects at higher level, and the remaining at standard level."

https://www.ibo.org/university-admission/support-students-transition-to-higher-education/course-selection-guidance/

This is the issue with IB. Top students will take about 15 AP’s, while IB students take at most 4 high level (HL). For the extended essay, AP also has the diploma program with AP Research and AP Seminar. Few high schools offer it, but there’s also the option for online. IB is less flexible and in my view not the best choice for the top student.

IB is 11th grade and 12th grade only. During 9th grade and 10th grade, "top students" take APs. In addition, universities give credit for IB SL classes as well as IB HL classes. For example, University of Maryland College Park: https://www.transfercredit.umd.edu/plc/IBGenEd.pdf

Not sure you actually read the link you posted. Take math for example, it only gives credit for HL for Calculus I and Statistics 100, no credit for SL. The distribution of APs is not the same over all high school years. Often strong students take 10 APs in 11th and 12th, compared to 4 HL for IB. It is still in favor of AP. You can do a combination of IB and AP but it just highlights that IB is not that great of a program on its own.

There are a lot of other SL classes that UMD does give credit for. Math is not everything. Plus if you're a math person, you're taking HL, not SL.

Are AP and IB the same? No, but then nobody said they are. HL classes are two-year classes, so yes, if your goal is to have the largest number of tests, then you should do AP, not IB.

In science, do students take a year of each science (Bio? Chem? Physics?) before SL/HL?

If not, it seems lopsided.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:MCPS is heavily invested in IB, since there are several regional programs (Kennedy, Springbrook, Watkins Mill) along with the school-specific programs (Einstein, B-CC, Rockville, Seneca Valley) and of course the creme de la creme, the IB magnet program (Richard Montgomery).

I hear from some parents and students that they don't think IB is worth it cause it's hard. But I'd love to hear success stories from parents and students who did it and found it valuable and found success post-high school.

So can anyone whose kids graduated from the IB Diploma Program share their success stories?

I'm sure the magnet kids have many of these, but I'd love to hear the experience of non-magnet families primarily, but I'll take what I can get.

It was hard. It wasn't very relevant to career track, but it was a place to meet smart hardworking friends and build her social network for life, and prepared for the same experience again at college. Gateway to UMC adult culture.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You also have to realize that IB will slow down the most advanced kids. You are limited in the number of HL classes and IB is limited to the last two years of high school. My most advanced kid chose AP instead of IB at one of MCPS’ school IB programs. The key was that she has AP classes in all areas - English, Calculus, History, Govt, Sci, Foreign Language.

They really limit the number of HLs you can take? Or are you saying there just isn't a way to fit in as many as a kid would want becuase each takes 2 years?

"Each student takes at least three (but not more than four) subjects at higher level, and the remaining at standard level."

https://www.ibo.org/university-admission/support-students-transition-to-higher-education/course-selection-guidance/

This is the issue with IB. Top students will take about 15 AP’s, while IB students take at most 4 high level (HL). For the extended essay, AP also has the diploma program with AP Research and AP Seminar. Few high schools offer it, but there’s also the option for online. IB is less flexible and in my view not the best choice for the top student.

IB is 11th grade and 12th grade only. During 9th grade and 10th grade, "top students" take APs. In addition, universities give credit for IB SL classes as well as IB HL classes. For example, University of Maryland College Park: https://www.transfercredit.umd.edu/plc/IBGenEd.pdf

Not sure you actually read the link you posted. Take math for example, it only gives credit for HL for Calculus I and Statistics 100, no credit for SL. The distribution of APs is not the same over all high school years. Often strong students take 10 APs in 11th and 12th, compared to 4 HL for IB. It is still in favor of AP. You can do a combination of IB and AP but it just highlights that IB is not that great of a program on its own.

There are a lot of other SL classes that UMD does give credit for. Math is not everything. Plus if you're a math person, you're taking HL, not SL.

Are AP and IB the same? No, but then nobody said they are. HL classes are two-year classes, so yes, if your goal is to have the largest number of tests, then you should do AP, not IB.

Right. It all depends on the student/family's goals.

If the student's priority is to rack up as many college credits while staying in the school building, then AP makes sense.

If the student's priority is to rack up the maximum number of college credits that are more likely to transfer AND they want to get out of their high school building, than dual enrollment makes sense.

If the student's priority is to take on course work that mimics college in terms of demanding writing, research and expression of thought, than IB is the best as that seems to really prepare students best for the 4-year college expectations, with the bonus of being transferrable especially if the student is interested in international study.

Genuinely interested in knowing what evidence you have for the bolder, besides anecdotal stories. You hear that all the time from proponents of IB, but I’m not sure it’s that clear cut.

AP English Lang and Lit, all History, AP Capstone etc, they all are very demanding in terms of writing, critical thinking etc. can you honestly say they are less demanding than IB?

I don’t want to generalize, but an International studies major is just too narrow and it sounds like one of those useless degrees.

Review the replies in this very thread where story after story is shared about how IB better prepared their kids for college. Anecdotes is all I have for you because I'm a parent and that's what I have to rely on.

Also, the admissions impact for students who apply to college pursuing the IB Diploma versus kids who just take an assortment of AP classes suggests the holistic commitment to the IB program stands out as a win for admissions and college preparation in general.

Here's a recent article from an online university that backs up this viewpoint: https://www.dwight.edu/dwight-global-online-school/about/online-learning-blog/do-colleges-prefer-ap-or-ib

College and university admissions representatives consistently speak highly of the program, saying success in the IB Diploma Program correlates with success in competitive colleges.

Here's some research from 2018 that says IB students are more sought after by more elite universities as well: https://pages.crimsoneducation.org/rs/039-NBM-750/images/FL-10-2018-ib-student-acceptance-rates-at-top-us-universities.pdf?mkt_tok=eyJpIjoiWTJaalltRTJOV0kzT1#:~:text=One%20thing%20is%20for%20sure,pushed%20yourself%20to%20get%20them.

A survey of more than 4,000 students conducted by the International Insight Research Group in partnership with the International Baccalaureate Organisation (IBO) showed that the acceptance rate of IB students into Ivy League universities is up to 18% higher than the total population acceptance rate. The gap is even more significant for top-ranked universities outside of the Ivy League, where it is 22% higher, on average.

[Anonymous]

Has anyone's child successfully matriculated overseas with their IB degree?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You also have to realize that IB will slow down the most advanced kids. You are limited in the number of HL classes and IB is limited to the last two years of high school. My most advanced kid chose AP instead of IB at one of MCPS’ school IB programs. The key was that she has AP classes in all areas - English, Calculus, History, Govt, Sci, Foreign Language.

They really limit the number of HLs you can take? Or are you saying there just isn't a way to fit in as many as a kid would want becuase each takes 2 years?

"Each student takes at least three (but not more than four) subjects at higher level, and the remaining at standard level."

https://www.ibo.org/university-admission/support-students-transition-to-higher-education/course-selection-guidance/

This is the issue with IB. Top students will take about 15 AP’s, while IB students take at most 4 high level (HL). For the extended essay, AP also has the diploma program with AP Research and AP Seminar. Few high schools offer it, but there’s also the option for online. IB is less flexible and in my view not the best choice for the top student.

IB is 11th grade and 12th grade only. During 9th grade and 10th grade, "top students" take APs. In addition, universities give credit for IB SL classes as well as IB HL classes. For example, University of Maryland College Park: https://www.transfercredit.umd.edu/plc/IBGenEd.pdf

Not sure you actually read the link you posted. Take math for example, it only gives credit for HL for Calculus I and Statistics 100, no credit for SL. The distribution of APs is not the same over all high school years. Often strong students take 10 APs in 11th and 12th, compared to 4 HL for IB. It is still in favor of AP. You can do a combination of IB and AP but it just highlights that IB is not that great of a program on its own.

There are a lot of other SL classes that UMD does give credit for. Math is not everything. Plus if you're a math person, you're taking HL, not SL.

Are AP and IB the same? No, but then nobody said they are. HL classes are two-year classes, so yes, if your goal is to have the largest number of tests, then you should do AP, not IB.

Right. It all depends on the student/family's goals.

If the student's priority is to rack up as many college credits while staying in the school building, then AP makes sense.

If the student's priority is to rack up the maximum number of college credits that are more likely to transfer AND they want to get out of their high school building, than dual enrollment makes sense.

If the student's priority is to take on course work that mimics college in terms of demanding writing, research and expression of thought, than IB is the best as that seems to really prepare students best for the 4-year college expectations, with the bonus of being transferrable especially if the student is interested in international study.

Genuinely interested in knowing what evidence you have for the bolder, besides anecdotal stories. You hear that all the time from proponents of IB, but I’m not sure it’s that clear cut.

AP English Lang and Lit, all History, AP Capstone etc, they all are very demanding in terms of writing, critical thinking etc. can you honestly say they are less demanding than IB?

I don’t want to generalize, but an International studies major is just too narrow and it sounds like one of those useless degrees.

Review the replies in this very thread where story after story is shared about how IB better prepared their kids for college. Anecdotes is all I have for you because I'm a parent and that's what I have to rely on.

Also, the admissions impact for students who apply to college pursuing the IB Diploma versus kids who just take an assortment of AP classes suggests the holistic commitment to the IB program stands out as a win for admissions and college preparation in general.

Here's a recent article from an online university that backs up this viewpoint: https://www.dwight.edu/dwight-global-online-school/about/online-learning-blog/do-colleges-prefer-ap-or-ib

College and university admissions representatives consistently speak highly of the program, saying success in the IB Diploma Program correlates with success in competitive colleges.

Here's some research from 2018 that says IB students are more sought after by more elite universities as well: https://pages.crimsoneducation.org/rs/039-NBM-750/images/FL-10-2018-ib-student-acceptance-rates-at-top-us-universities.pdf?mkt_tok=eyJpIjoiWTJaalltRTJOV0kzT1#:~:text=One%20thing%20is%20for%20sure,pushed%20yourself%20to%20get%20them.

A survey of more than 4,000 students conducted by the International Insight Research Group in partnership with the International Baccalaureate Organisation (IBO) showed that the acceptance rate of IB students into Ivy League universities is up to 18% higher than the total population acceptance rate. The gap is even more significant for top-ranked universities outside of the Ivy League, where it is 22% higher, on average.

Let’s assess IB vs AP based on a survey run by the organization selling the IB curriculum and in how proud parents are of their children. I’m sure IB teaches critical thinking better than this.

[Anonymous]

More data from the IB program from 2021: https://www.ibo.org/globalassets/new-structure/research/pdfs/key-findings-from-research-on-the-impact-of-the-dp-en.pdf

Consistent with previous research(Bergeron 2015; Halic 2013; Caspary 2011), findings showed that 84.6% of DP candidates enrolled in university immediately after graduating from high school compared to 66% of all US high school graduates. Of the DP students who enrolled in college immediately after high school, 90.4% returned to the same institution the following year compared to 80% of all US students (figure 2) (Pilchen, Caspary, Woodworth 2020).

It seems like that persistence metric, which shows a 10% increase for IB DP candidates, is one way they're substantiating that IB does a good job of developing college readiness, since that pool of students are less likely to drop out compared to non-IB kids.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You also have to realize that IB will slow down the most advanced kids. You are limited in the number of HL classes and IB is limited to the last two years of high school. My most advanced kid chose AP instead of IB at one of MCPS’ school IB programs. The key was that she has AP classes in all areas - English, Calculus, History, Govt, Sci, Foreign Language.

They really limit the number of HLs you can take? Or are you saying there just isn't a way to fit in as many as a kid would want becuase each takes 2 years?

"Each student takes at least three (but not more than four) subjects at higher level, and the remaining at standard level."

https://www.ibo.org/university-admission/support-students-transition-to-higher-education/course-selection-guidance/

This is the issue with IB. Top students will take about 15 AP’s, while IB students take at most 4 high level (HL). For the extended essay, AP also has the diploma program with AP Research and AP Seminar. Few high schools offer it, but there’s also the option for online. IB is less flexible and in my view not the best choice for the top student.

IB is 11th grade and 12th grade only. During 9th grade and 10th grade, "top students" take APs. In addition, universities give credit for IB SL classes as well as IB HL classes. For example, University of Maryland College Park: https://www.transfercredit.umd.edu/plc/IBGenEd.pdf

Not sure you actually read the link you posted. Take math for example, it only gives credit for HL for Calculus I and Statistics 100, no credit for SL. The distribution of APs is not the same over all high school years. Often strong students take 10 APs in 11th and 12th, compared to 4 HL for IB. It is still in favor of AP. You can do a combination of IB and AP but it just highlights that IB is not that great of a program on its own.

There are a lot of other SL classes that UMD does give credit for. Math is not everything. Plus if you're a math person, you're taking HL, not SL.

Are AP and IB the same? No, but then nobody said they are. HL classes are two-year classes, so yes, if your goal is to have the largest number of tests, then you should do AP, not IB.

Right. It all depends on the student/family's goals.

If the student's priority is to rack up as many college credits while staying in the school building, then AP makes sense.

If the student's priority is to rack up the maximum number of college credits that are more likely to transfer AND they want to get out of their high school building, than dual enrollment makes sense.

If the student's priority is to take on course work that mimics college in terms of demanding writing, research and expression of thought, than IB is the best as that seems to really prepare students best for the 4-year college expectations, with the bonus of being transferrable especially if the student is interested in international study.

Genuinely interested in knowing what evidence you have for the bolder, besides anecdotal stories. You hear that all the time from proponents of IB, but I’m not sure it’s that clear cut.

AP English Lang and Lit, all History, AP Capstone etc, they all are very demanding in terms of writing, critical thinking etc. can you honestly say they are less demanding than IB?

I don’t want to generalize, but an International studies major is just too narrow and it sounds like one of those useless degrees.

Review the replies in this very thread where story after story is shared about how IB better prepared their kids for college. Anecdotes is all I have for you because I'm a parent and that's what I have to rely on.

Also, the admissions impact for students who apply to college pursuing the IB Diploma versus kids who just take an assortment of AP classes suggests the holistic commitment to the IB program stands out as a win for admissions and college preparation in general.

Here's a recent article from an online university that backs up this viewpoint: https://www.dwight.edu/dwight-global-online-school/about/online-learning-blog/do-colleges-prefer-ap-or-ib

College and university admissions representatives consistently speak highly of the program, saying success in the IB Diploma Program correlates with success in competitive colleges.

Here's some research from 2018 that says IB students are more sought after by more elite universities as well: https://pages.crimsoneducation.org/rs/039-NBM-750/images/FL-10-2018-ib-student-acceptance-rates-at-top-us-universities.pdf?mkt_tok=eyJpIjoiWTJaalltRTJOV0kzT1#:~:text=One%20thing%20is%20for%20sure,pushed%20yourself%20to%20get%20them.

A survey of more than 4,000 students conducted by the International Insight Research Group in partnership with the International Baccalaureate Organisation (IBO) showed that the acceptance rate of IB students into Ivy League universities is up to 18% higher than the total population acceptance rate. The gap is even more significant for top-ranked universities outside of the Ivy League, where it is 22% higher, on average.

Let’s assess IB vs AP based on a survey run by the organization selling the IB curriculum and in how proud parents are of their children. I’m sure IB teaches critical thinking better than this.

Do you use data to substantiate AP that doesn't come from the College Board? Who else would you expect to be invested enough to fund the study of such research?

Look at the research and methodology and if you find a significant flaw, fine. But you can't dismiss the research simply because it's coming from IB. That'd be like saying you don't trust data about MCPS because it comes from MCPS. Who the hell else do you expect to be the source of the data if not the curriculum provider themselves?

Show me all of the AP data that the College Board has no thumbprint on. I'll wait.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You also have to realize that IB will slow down the most advanced kids. You are limited in the number of HL classes and IB is limited to the last two years of high school. My most advanced kid chose AP instead of IB at one of MCPS’ school IB programs. The key was that she has AP classes in all areas - English, Calculus, History, Govt, Sci, Foreign Language.

They really limit the number of HLs you can take? Or are you saying there just isn't a way to fit in as many as a kid would want becuase each takes 2 years?

"Each student takes at least three (but not more than four) subjects at higher level, and the remaining at standard level."

https://www.ibo.org/university-admission/support-students-transition-to-higher-education/course-selection-guidance/

This is the issue with IB. Top students will take about 15 AP’s, while IB students take at most 4 high level (HL). For the extended essay, AP also has the diploma program with AP Research and AP Seminar. Few high schools offer it, but there’s also the option for online. IB is less flexible and in my view not the best choice for the top student.

IB is 11th grade and 12th grade only. During 9th grade and 10th grade, "top students" take APs. In addition, universities give credit for IB SL classes as well as IB HL classes. For example, University of Maryland College Park: https://www.transfercredit.umd.edu/plc/IBGenEd.pdf

Not sure you actually read the link you posted. Take math for example, it only gives credit for HL for Calculus I and Statistics 100, no credit for SL. The distribution of APs is not the same over all high school years. Often strong students take 10 APs in 11th and 12th, compared to 4 HL for IB. It is still in favor of AP. You can do a combination of IB and AP but it just highlights that IB is not that great of a program on its own.

There are a lot of other SL classes that UMD does give credit for. Math is not everything. Plus if you're a math person, you're taking HL, not SL.

Are AP and IB the same? No, but then nobody said they are. HL classes are two-year classes, so yes, if your goal is to have the largest number of tests, then you should do AP, not IB.

Right. It all depends on the student/family's goals.

If the student's priority is to rack up as many college credits while staying in the school building, then AP makes sense.

If the student's priority is to rack up the maximum number of college credits that are more likely to transfer AND they want to get out of their high school building, than dual enrollment makes sense.

If the student's priority is to take on course work that mimics college in terms of demanding writing, research and expression of thought, than IB is the best as that seems to really prepare students best for the 4-year college expectations, with the bonus of being transferrable especially if the student is interested in international study.

Genuinely interested in knowing what evidence you have for the bolder, besides anecdotal stories. You hear that all the time from proponents of IB, but I’m not sure it’s that clear cut.

AP English Lang and Lit, all History, AP Capstone etc, they all are very demanding in terms of writing, critical thinking etc. can you honestly say they are less demanding than IB?

I don’t want to generalize, but an International studies major is just too narrow and it sounds like one of those useless degrees.

Review the replies in this very thread where story after story is shared about how IB better prepared their kids for college. Anecdotes is all I have for you because I'm a parent and that's what I have to rely on.

Also, the admissions impact for students who apply to college pursuing the IB Diploma versus kids who just take an assortment of AP classes suggests the holistic commitment to the IB program stands out as a win for admissions and college preparation in general.

Here's a recent article from an online university that backs up this viewpoint: https://www.dwight.edu/dwight-global-online-school/about/online-learning-blog/do-colleges-prefer-ap-or-ib

College and university admissions representatives consistently speak highly of the program, saying success in the IB Diploma Program correlates with success in competitive colleges.

Here's some research from 2018 that says IB students are more sought after by more elite universities as well: https://pages.crimsoneducation.org/rs/039-NBM-750/images/FL-10-2018-ib-student-acceptance-rates-at-top-us-universities.pdf?mkt_tok=eyJpIjoiWTJaalltRTJOV0kzT1#:~:text=One%20thing%20is%20for%20sure,pushed%20yourself%20to%20get%20them.

A survey of more than 4,000 students conducted by the International Insight Research Group in partnership with the International Baccalaureate Organisation (IBO) showed that the acceptance rate of IB students into Ivy League universities is up to 18% higher than the total population acceptance rate. The gap is even more significant for top-ranked universities outside of the Ivy League, where it is 22% higher, on average.

Uh ..

Look, I think IB is a great program, but that's not proof of superiority over AP.

"total population" is not the same as "AP Scholars". You have to compare similar course loads attempted, and correlate by middle school / early high school performance.

Dwight says "Do Colleges Prefer AP or IB?
Both academic options are looked on favorably by colleges and universities, and both can help earn a student college credit, depending on exam scores. The IB is increasing in popularity in the United States, especially among international families and students who hope to study abroad."

That web page is an SEO info dump pushing both sides, not a judgement of which is better.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:You also have to realize that IB will slow down the most advanced kids. You are limited in the number of HL classes and IB is limited to the last two years of high school. My most advanced kid chose AP instead of IB at one of MCPS’ school IB programs. The key was that she has AP classes in all areas - English, Calculus, History, Govt, Sci, Foreign Language.

They really limit the number of HLs you can take? Or are you saying there just isn't a way to fit in as many as a kid would want becuase each takes 2 years?

"Each student takes at least three (but not more than four) subjects at higher level, and the remaining at standard level."

https://www.ibo.org/university-admission/support-students-transition-to-higher-education/course-selection-guidance/

This is the issue with IB. Top students will take about 15 AP’s, while IB students take at most 4 high level (HL). For the extended essay, AP also has the diploma program with AP Research and AP Seminar. Few high schools offer it, but there’s also the option for online. IB is less flexible and in my view not the best choice for the top student.

IB is 11th grade and 12th grade only. During 9th grade and 10th grade, "top students" take APs. In addition, universities give credit for IB SL classes as well as IB HL classes. For example, University of Maryland College Park: https://www.transfercredit.umd.edu/plc/IBGenEd.pdf

Not sure you actually read the link you posted. Take math for example, it only gives credit for HL for Calculus I and Statistics 100, no credit for SL. The distribution of APs is not the same over all high school years. Often strong students take 10 APs in 11th and 12th, compared to 4 HL for IB. It is still in favor of AP. You can do a combination of IB and AP but it just highlights that IB is not that great of a program on its own.

There are a lot of other SL classes that UMD does give credit for. Math is not everything. Plus if you're a math person, you're taking HL, not SL.

Are AP and IB the same? No, but then nobody said they are. HL classes are two-year classes, so yes, if your goal is to have the largest number of tests, then you should do AP, not IB.

What is in your view the advantages of IB over AP, if ‘number of tests’ is not something you’d consider?

Take sciences for example. Physics, Biology, Computer Science, no credit for SL. Chemistry gets credit for SL. For a STEM oriented student IB makes less sense than AP. From the list you gave, there’s more credit if you’re leaning towards humanities, but most universities give less. The norm is not getting credit for SL, but I’m sure you already know this.

You can argue that the credit universities are giving for these classes is a measure of the strength of the program. The goal is to take the most rigorous coursework while maintaining good grades. IB puts a ceiling on that most rigorous, at least for STEM.

A STEM oriented student will take HL STEM classes.

In any case, you seem to be confusing "rigor" and quantity. Why would one AP class per year, for 2 years, be more "rigorous" than one two-year IB HL class?

[Anonymous]

I'm waiting to to hear from parents of identical twins who expect their kids between IB and AP at schools with comparable student cohort.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You also have to realize that IB will slow down the most advanced kids. You are limited in the number of HL classes and IB is limited to the last two years of high school. My most advanced kid chose AP instead of IB at one of MCPS’ school IB programs. The key was that she has AP classes in all areas - English, Calculus, History, Govt, Sci, Foreign Language.

They really limit the number of HLs you can take? Or are you saying there just isn't a way to fit in as many as a kid would want becuase each takes 2 years?

"Each student takes at least three (but not more than four) subjects at higher level, and the remaining at standard level."

https://www.ibo.org/university-admission/support-students-transition-to-higher-education/course-selection-guidance/

This is the issue with IB. Top students will take about 15 AP’s, while IB students take at most 4 high level (HL). For the extended essay, AP also has the diploma program with AP Research and AP Seminar. Few high schools offer it, but there’s also the option for online. IB is less flexible and in my view not the best choice for the top student.

IB is 11th grade and 12th grade only. During 9th grade and 10th grade, "top students" take APs. In addition, universities give credit for IB SL classes as well as IB HL classes. For example, University of Maryland College Park: https://www.transfercredit.umd.edu/plc/IBGenEd.pdf

Not sure you actually read the link you posted. Take math for example, it only gives credit for HL for Calculus I and Statistics 100, no credit for SL. The distribution of APs is not the same over all high school years. Often strong students take 10 APs in 11th and 12th, compared to 4 HL for IB. It is still in favor of AP. You can do a combination of IB and AP but it just highlights that IB is not that great of a program on its own.

There are a lot of other SL classes that UMD does give credit for. Math is not everything. Plus if you're a math person, you're taking HL, not SL.

Are AP and IB the same? No, but then nobody said they are. HL classes are two-year classes, so yes, if your goal is to have the largest number of tests, then you should do AP, not IB.

In science, do students take a year of each science (Bio? Chem? Physics?) before SL/HL?

If not, it seems lopsided.

"Each science" what? Yes, IB Diploma Programme students (in 11th and 12th grade) took science classes in 9th and 10th grade.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You also have to realize that IB will slow down the most advanced kids. You are limited in the number of HL classes and IB is limited to the last two years of high school. My most advanced kid chose AP instead of IB at one of MCPS’ school IB programs. The key was that she has AP classes in all areas - English, Calculus, History, Govt, Sci, Foreign Language.

They really limit the number of HLs you can take? Or are you saying there just isn't a way to fit in as many as a kid would want becuase each takes 2 years?

"Each student takes at least three (but not more than four) subjects at higher level, and the remaining at standard level."

https://www.ibo.org/university-admission/support-students-transition-to-higher-education/course-selection-guidance/

This is the issue with IB. Top students will take about 15 AP’s, while IB students take at most 4 high level (HL). For the extended essay, AP also has the diploma program with AP Research and AP Seminar. Few high schools offer it, but there’s also the option for online. IB is less flexible and in my view not the best choice for the top student.

IB is 11th grade and 12th grade only. During 9th grade and 10th grade, "top students" take APs. In addition, universities give credit for IB SL classes as well as IB HL classes. For example, University of Maryland College Park: https://www.transfercredit.umd.edu/plc/IBGenEd.pdf

Not sure you actually read the link you posted. Take math for example, it only gives credit for HL for Calculus I and Statistics 100, no credit for SL. The distribution of APs is not the same over all high school years. Often strong students take 10 APs in 11th and 12th, compared to 4 HL for IB. It is still in favor of AP. You can do a combination of IB and AP but it just highlights that IB is not that great of a program on its own.

There are a lot of other SL classes that UMD does give credit for. Math is not everything. Plus if you're a math person, you're taking HL, not SL.

Are AP and IB the same? No, but then nobody said they are. HL classes are two-year classes, so yes, if your goal is to have the largest number of tests, then you should do AP, not IB.

In science, do students take a year of each science (Bio? Chem? Physics?) before SL/HL?

If not, it seems lopsided.

"Each science" what? Yes, IB Diploma Programme students (in 11th and 12th grade) took science classes in 9th and 10th grade.

*Which* science classes?