Why does Baltimore have such a large Orthodox Jewish population?

[Anonymous]

I just want to say that I like this thread and I am learning a lot. The stuff on timers or hiring someone as a workaround reminds me of the amish- sure they are off the grid, but then they get their propane in so that in can power their washing machines, etc. Is there a lot of other examples "technicality" versus the "spirit of the religion" that go on?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I just want to say that I like this thread and I am learning a lot. The stuff on timers or hiring someone as a workaround reminds me of the amish- sure they are off the grid, but then they get their propane in so that in can power their washing machines, etc. Is there a lot of other examples "technicality" versus the "spirit of the religion" that go on?

But the "spirit of the religion" is the technicalities. We're a religion of endless debates over technical details. We aren't allowed to have chametz on Passover so we sell it. We just lock it up in a closet for the duration of Passover. And then buy it back as soon as Passover is over! Done!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I just want to say that I like this thread and I am learning a lot. The stuff on timers or hiring someone as a workaround reminds me of the amish- sure they are off the grid, but then they get their propane in so that in can power their washing machines, etc. Is there a lot of other examples "technicality" versus the "spirit of the religion" that go on?

But the "spirit of the religion" is the technicalities. We're a religion of endless debates over technical details. We aren't allowed to have chametz on Passover so we sell it. We just lock it up in a closet for the duration of Passover. And then buy it back as soon as Passover is over! Done!

Interesting! At least there are lots of debates, right? That makes it a little more progressive? So do you "have" chametz and lock it away or does it have to leave the house entirely and be sold/bought back? Not understanding that part.

[Anonymous]

It is a double standard
ridiculous clowning around with religion.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I just want to say that I like this thread and I am learning a lot. The stuff on timers or hiring someone as a workaround reminds me of the amish- sure they are off the grid, but then they get their propane in so that in can power their washing machines, etc. Is there a lot of other examples "technicality" versus the "spirit of the religion" that go on?

But the "spirit of the religion" is the technicalities. We're a religion of endless debates over technical details. We aren't allowed to have chametz on Passover so we sell it. We just lock it up in a closet for the duration of Passover. And then buy it back as soon as Passover is over! Done!

Interesting! At least there are lots of debates, right? That makes it a little more progressive? So do you "have" chametz and lock it away or does it have to leave the house entirely and be sold/bought back? Not understanding that part.

In my background, you're supposed to eat as much as possible in the weeks preceding Passover (meaning, starting now you're have a lot of pasta, rice, etc to clean out the fridge). Then whatever is left, you move to a box or spare pantry, tape it shut, and symbolically sell it for a dollar or two to a rabbi. I no longer follow this practice.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I just want to say that I like this thread and I am learning a lot. The stuff on timers or hiring someone as a workaround reminds me of the amish- sure they are off the grid, but then they get their propane in so that in can power their washing machines, etc. Is there a lot of other examples "technicality" versus the "spirit of the religion" that go on?

But the "spirit of the religion" is the technicalities. We're a religion of endless debates over technical details. We aren't allowed to have chametz on Passover so we sell it. We just lock it up in a closet for the duration of Passover. And then buy it back as soon as Passover is over! Done!

Interesting! At least there are lots of debates, right? That makes it a little more progressive? So do you "have" chametz and lock it away or does it have to leave the house entirely and be sold/bought back? Not understanding that part.

I'm a person who gets rid of chametz altogether before Passover, so I don't do the selling/buying back. BUT! A large part of Judaism is based on reading the teachings and arguing about what they mean. There are while books just made up of transcripts of rabbis' arguments. That's part of the reason that (1) Jews value education, and (2) the religion is ever- changing and -evolving. It can be pretty exciting.

[Anonymous]

This is all exciting! I'm PP here and this is fascinating. Also that you a) eat tons before passover and b) can sell it to the rabbi -- to the rabbi?!! Hi, I'm the rabbi. I'll take all that chametz so you aren't tempted by chocolate croissants. I'm sure there is a good reason and I'm not trying to be disrespectful. Someone make a joke, please?

[Anonymous]

PPs are right about the origin of this community. It has grown because (a) Orthodox Jews have a lot of kids; (b) some NYC people have relocated for the cost of living; and (c) it seems like nobody leaves the community.

I left it- religious zealotry and mindless adherence to ritual requirements, when combined with Baltimore's small - town mentality, were suffocating.

So I got out. I have cousins in arranged marriages- one to a 19-year-old he met twice before the wedding.

That people romanticize this cult amazes me.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Chinese food is more of a secular/cultural Jewish phenomenon, not an Orthodox one.

It has seeped over - there are quite a bunch of kosher chinese places. Baltimore used to have Chapps. Not sure if there is any kosher chinese there now.

David Chu's is and is pretty good.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:This is all exciting! I'm PP here and this is fascinating. Also that you a) eat tons before passover and b) can sell it to the rabbi -- to the rabbi?!! Hi, I'm the rabbi. I'll take all that chametz so you aren't tempted by chocolate croissants. I'm sure there is a good reason and I'm not trying to be disrespectful. Someone make a joke, please?

The rabbi is just the agent of the sale. The buyer is not Jewish. I always want to meet the buyer. Technically, he has a key to my house and can come and grab something from the cabinet any time he pleases. (This has never actually happened)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:This is all exciting! I'm PP here and this is fascinating. Also that you a) eat tons before passover and b) can sell it to the rabbi -- to the rabbi?!! Hi, I'm the rabbi. I'll take all that chametz so you aren't tempted by chocolate croissants. I'm sure there is a good reason and I'm not trying to be disrespectful. Someone make a joke, please?

I posted above. The way it was done in my community growing up is that it's entirely symbolic. No one takes a box of food to the rabbi's house (that I'm aware of). The food is in a taped box in the basement. It comes back upstairs when Passover ends.

[Anonymous]

Ner Israel and its founders gets the credit. Also the establishment of the eruv, the tendency of the Jewish community at large to live together - 75% in five contiguous zip codes, the day school options, affordability of Baltimore even tho it is "out of town"; proximity to New York, Munsey, Lakewood, etc; approximately 50 frum shuls within the eruv; an increasing infrastructure of shops, restaurants, kollels, grocery stores, dry cleaners, lawyers, doctors, etc; and I could go on and on! And, yes, at about 35,000 I believe that we have the largest percentage of orthodox anywhere in the US, outside of New York.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:One wonders why they stay there.

As previously pointed out, it's not easy to move when there's an infrastructure built around your culture. There's the Jewish schools and yeshivas, kosher restaurants, synagogues, etc. and it's also not entirely easy to pick up and move away from a place your family has lived for generations.

My grandparents lived in an Orthodox neighborhood in Baltimore. It's still majority Orthodox, though there are a number of AA families now, starting in the 1980s. (Traditionally, Baltimore AAs and Jews have gotten along really well.) When their Orthodox neighbors moved out, to be closer to one of theirs daughters--this was a 9-child family with modern "arranged marriages"--another Orthodox family moved in.

so would you say it is the need to segregate from mainstream society?
I am surprised you day that the in Baltimore they get along with the AAs. My experience has been the opposite.

Pretty much nobody gets along with poor AAs. Not even other poor AAs, honestly.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:One wonders why they stay there.

As previously pointed out, it's not easy to move when there's an infrastructure built around your culture. There's the Jewish schools and yeshivas, kosher restaurants, synagogues, etc. and it's also not entirely easy to pick up and move away from a place your family has lived for generations.

My grandparents lived in an Orthodox neighborhood in Baltimore. It's still majority Orthodox, though there are a number of AA families now, starting in the 1980s. (Traditionally, Baltimore AAs and Jews have gotten along really well.) When their Orthodox neighbors moved out, to be closer to one of theirs daughters--this was a 9-child family with modern "arranged marriages"--another Orthodox family moved in.

so would you say it is the need to segregate from mainstream society?
I am surprised you day that the in Baltimore they get along with the AAs. My experience has been the opposite.

Pretty much nobody gets along with poor AAs. Not even other poor AAs, honestly.

I'm not actually touching that question; I just think it's curious that you assumed they were poor. It was a middle-class blue-collar neighborhood.

FWIW, Jews were big supporters of the fight for civil rights. My mom, who grew up in the aforementioned Baltimore neighborhood, marched with MLK Jr, as did many other Jews. http://www.thejewishweek.com/arts/herschthal-arts/king-and-jews-beyond-heschel

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Am I the only shiksa who thinks the word goy is offensive?

Every Yiddish word sounds offensive. Take mensch for instance. It's a good thing to be. It's just one of those languages. Im reminded of Homer Simpson overhearing people speaking Chinese, "beautiful language, isn't it, Marge?"