Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:whats a too far commute and too young? the high level mini-documentaries about players out west seem to think an hour to two commute one way, while doing work in the car is bo big thing. maybe here we just dont want it enough and conplain too much too offset the potential of not succeeding.

You're missing the point. To grow the sport in this country, and to eventually net a more talented national team, you need to expand the options, not cut them down. It really does not matter what league is better or if there is a national super playoff. If you consolidate, such that an hour or two commute is necessary for some players, you will retire more of them early and never get to see what they might become.

The argument that you want the best to train with the best will always happen to some extent. That's why we have NTC, youth national teams, US Soccer scouts, ID sessions, showcases, etc. These things filter out the best and collect the cream of the crop. ODP was once a part of this but most local elite players think they are beyond it and do not participate (I'm mainly talking about the dearth of ECNL players in ODP these days). With the ECNL and DA coexisting, you do lose some average skill level at the local clubs in day to day practice, however the amount by which you might raise the average talent level at your local DA club by consolidation is trivial relative to the talent lost by the consolidation. It is the job of NTC and other select programs to find and offer the next level opportunities.

ECNL and DA are not the same. They present two different formulas to allow elite players options that fit their lives. So much the better for letting high level players as long as possible.

I think the folks clamoring for consolidation are the same folks who see the bottom half of the roster as filler keeping their children from getting more playing time and winning more. The priorities are still too involved with winning. At 14, 15, 16 years you still do not know just how good players can become.

Good points but I still think players with potential to learn higher level aspects of the game are held back. Team need some players willing and able to try to execute more advanced strategies. It is a team game and the entire team can struggle to move beyond the weak spots.

A simplistic example but what use is a give and go if the play always ends after the give part?

Anonymous wrote:Poster said that was a simplistic example to make the point. In my experience for example, if the coach sends out an email with written material for the players to review before practice, half or more don't bother. Stops the ones motivated eager to get out try it dead in their tracks if majority of team is unprepared and uninterested.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:whats a too far commute and too young? the high level mini-documentaries about players out west seem to think an hour to two commute one way, while doing work in the car is bo big thing. maybe here we just dont want it enough and conplain too much too offset the potential of not succeeding.

You're missing the point. To grow the sport in this country, and to eventually net a more talented national team, you need to expand the options, not cut them down. It really does not matter what league is better or if there is a national super playoff. If you consolidate, such that an hour or two commute is necessary for some players, you will retire more of them early and never get to see what they might become.

The argument that you want the best to train with the best will always happen to some extent. That's why we have NTC, youth national teams, US Soccer scouts, ID sessions, showcases, etc. These things filter out the best and collect the cream of the crop. ODP was once a part of this but most local elite players think they are beyond it and do not participate (I'm mainly talking about the dearth of ECNL players in ODP these days). With the ECNL and DA coexisting, you do lose some average skill level at the local clubs in day to day practice, however the amount by which you might raise the average talent level at your local DA club by consolidation is trivial relative to the talent lost by the consolidation. It is the job of NTC and other select programs to find and offer the next level opportunities.

ECNL and DA are not the same. They present two different formulas to allow elite players options that fit their lives. So much the better for letting high level players as long as possible.

I think the folks clamoring for consolidation are the same folks who see the bottom half of the roster as filler keeping their children from getting more playing time and winning more. The priorities are still too involved with winning. At 14, 15, 16 years you still do not know just how good players can become.

Good points but I still think players with potential to learn higher level aspects of the game are held back. Team need some players willing and able to try to execute more advanced strategies. It is a team game and the entire team can struggle to move beyond the weak spots.

A simplistic example but what use is a give and go if the play always ends after the give part?

If this is a actual problem then the need for more kids to be exposed to high level soccer is very important for the health of a soccer nation. To think that there are kids that executing a simple give and go by U12 means that our overall soccer sucks. This would be like a little league team that cant turn a double play in practice. Executing a give and go is pretty fundamental and as far as the rest of the world is concerned, the fact that your kid can execute this play is NOT proof of being an elite player.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:whats a too far commute and too young? the high level mini-documentaries about players out west seem to think an hour to two commute one way, while doing work in the car is bo big thing. maybe here we just dont want it enough and conplain too much too offset the potential of not succeeding.

You're missing the point. To grow the sport in this country, and to eventually net a more talented national team, you need to expand the options, not cut them down. It really does not matter what league is better or if there is a national super playoff. If you consolidate, such that an hour or two commute is necessary for some players, you will retire more of them early and never get to see what they might become.

The argument that you want the best to train with the best will always happen to some extent. That's why we have NTC, youth national teams, US Soccer scouts, ID sessions, showcases, etc. These things filter out the best and collect the cream of the crop. ODP was once a part of this but most local elite players think they are beyond it and do not participate (I'm mainly talking about the dearth of ECNL players in ODP these days). With the ECNL and DA coexisting, you do lose some average skill level at the local clubs in day to day practice, however the amount by which you might raise the average talent level at your local DA club by consolidation is trivial relative to the talent lost by the consolidation. It is the job of NTC and other select programs to find and offer the next level opportunities.

ECNL and DA are not the same. They present two different formulas to allow elite players options that fit their lives. So much the better for letting high level players as long as possible.

I think the folks clamoring for consolidation are the same folks who see the bottom half of the roster as filler keeping their children from getting more playing time and winning more. The priorities are still too involved with winning. At 14, 15, 16 years you still do not know just how good players can become.

Good points but I still think players with potential to learn higher level aspects of the game are held back. Team need some players willing and able to try to execute more advanced strategies. It is a team game and the entire team can struggle to move beyond the weak spots.

A simplistic example but what use is a give and go if the play always ends after the give part?

If this is a actual problem then the need for more kids to be exposed to high level soccer is very important for the health of a soccer nation. To think that there are kids that executing a simple give and go by U12 means that our overall soccer sucks. This would be like a little league team that cant turn a double play in practice. Executing a give and go is pretty fundamental and as far as the rest of the world is concerned, the fact that your kid can execute this play is NOT proof of being an elite player.

Stop and read please. The give and go is very simple and kids can do it. The poster did not say the kids could not do that. Some struggle with more complex play and it holds back the ones that are more capable.

This is not difficult to understand whether you are talking about a math class or a soccer class.

Anonymous wrote:I said in the post that it was a simplistic example used to make the point. Read it again. Just forget it and move on to the other example of not reviewing the written information and diagrams before practice.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I said in the post that it was a simplistic example used to make the point. Read it again. Just forget it and move on to the other example of not reviewing the written information and diagrams before practice.

We know your kid is super special and super dedicated. Oh, dear, where can she ever play with kids worthy of her acumen?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I said in the post that it was a simplistic example used to make the point. Read it again. Just forget it and move on to the other example of not reviewing the written information and diagrams before practice.

We know your kid is super special and super dedicated. Oh, dear, where can she ever play with kids worthy of her acumen?

Yo can argue till kingdom come that lots of these "elite" teams in these "elite" leagues have the roster depth to successfully appreciate, learn and execute higher level strategies but that wont make it true. Anyone with a teen out here in the trenches can see the dilution for themselves. You can continue this dumb argument solo.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I said in the post that it was a simplistic example used to make the point. Read it again. Just forget it and move on to the other example of not reviewing the written information and diagrams before practice.

We know your kid is super special and super dedicated. Oh, dear, where can she ever play with kids worthy of her acumen?

Yo can argue till kingdom come that lots of these "elite" teams in these "elite" leagues have the roster depth to successfully appreciate, learn and execute higher level strategies but that wont make it true. Anyone with a teen out here in the trenches can see the dilution for themselves. You can continue this dumb argument solo.

I'm not arguing that there is talent depth. What I am saying is that there are a lot of very average soccer players out there currently and that it is possible that your kid is simply just above average. I don't mean this as an insult just that we have a perspective of what "elite" is supposed to mean. And even though you are simply providing simple examples to make your point frankly, any example you can give just about any player at nearly any level in Europe or South America can execute as a bare minimum. the only real difference is the general pace of play.

Culturally we just don't really know how to play the game. We have lots of kids who can demonstrate the moves but we have very few multi generational players who just simply understand the game.

My point is, this is why our nets need to be cast as wide as possible to keep as many kids as possible playing the game as long as possible. If your kid is truly elite, yes, she may be held back some but in a relative sense it won't really matter.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I said in the post that it was a simplistic example used to make the point. Read it again. Just forget it and move on to the other example of not reviewing the written information and diagrams before practice.

We know your kid is super special and super dedicated. Oh, dear, where can she ever play with kids worthy of her acumen?

Yo can argue till kingdom come that lots of these "elite" teams in these "elite" leagues have the roster depth to successfully appreciate, learn and execute higher level strategies but that wont make it true. Anyone with a teen out here in the trenches can see the dilution for themselves. You can continue this dumb argument solo.

I'm not arguing that there is talent depth. What I am saying is that there are a lot of very average soccer players out there currently and that it is possible that your kid is simply just above average. I don't mean this as an insult just that we have a perspective of what "elite" is supposed to mean. And even though you are simply providing simple examples to make your point frankly, any example you can give just about any player at nearly any level in Europe or South America can execute as a bare minimum. the only real difference is the general pace of play.

Culturally we just don't really know how to play the game. We have lots of kids who can demonstrate the moves but we have very few multi generational players who just simply understand the game.

My point is, this is why our nets need to be cast as wide as possible to keep as many kids as possible playing the game as long as possible. If your kid is truly elite, yes, she may be held back some but in a relative sense it won't really matter.

Why would you compare youth soccer here to other places..it is fundamentally different. Show me a place where the families fork over thousands of dollars er year for soccer instruction, hotels, rental cars, plane tickets, etc and then we can make a comparison.

Never said my kid was going pro. I said that half the team does not even bother to come to practice prepared to learn. Problem has gotten worse with the complete over saturation of "elite" youth soccer options. I have a girl so this is just a total mess. At least boy in some areas in the right talent and location could play for a funded BDA. For girls the market was always for kids with some talent and the budgets to spend on developing it. There are no options is for girls that just have talent. They are of no value at all in this system.

I would go to a more inclusive, low travel cheaper option in a heart beat if it existed. Does not exist and not a thing I can do about it. We all have to look around and pick our poison and try to find an acceptable spot for our players. It is not like the choices are good.

What is good is the sport of soccer. Good thing for the soccer industrial complex that the game is so great or everyone would quit this crap tomorrow.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I said in the post that it was a simplistic example used to make the point. Read it again. Just forget it and move on to the other example of not reviewing the written information and diagrams before practice.

We know your kid is super special and super dedicated. Oh, dear, where can she ever play with kids worthy of her acumen?

Yo can argue till kingdom come that lots of these "elite" teams in these "elite" leagues have the roster depth to successfully appreciate, learn and execute higher level strategies but that wont make it true. Anyone with a teen out here in the trenches can see the dilution for themselves. You can continue this dumb argument solo.

I'm not arguing that there is talent depth. What I am saying is that there are a lot of very average soccer players out there currently and that it is possible that your kid is simply just above average. I don't mean this as an insult just that we have a perspective of what "elite" is supposed to mean. And even though you are simply providing simple examples to make your point frankly, any example you can give just about any player at nearly any level in Europe or South America can execute as a bare minimum. the only real difference is the general pace of play.

Culturally we just don't really know how to play the game. We have lots of kids who can demonstrate the moves but we have very few multi generational players who just simply understand the game.

My point is, this is why our nets need to be cast as wide as possible to keep as many kids as possible playing the game as long as possible. If your kid is truly elite, yes, she may be held back some but in a relative sense it won't really matter.

Why would you compare youth soccer here to other places..it is fundamentally different. Show me a place where the families fork over thousands of dollars er year for soccer instruction, hotels, rental cars, plane tickets, etc and then we can make a comparison.

Never said my kid was going pro. I said that half the team does not even bother to come to practice prepared to learn. Problem has gotten worse with the complete over saturation of "elite" youth soccer options. I have a girl so this is just a total mess. At least boy in some areas in the right talent and location could play for a funded BDA. For girls the market was always for kids with some talent and the budgets to spend on developing it. There are no options is for girls that just have talent. They are of no value at all in this system.

I would go to a more inclusive, low travel cheaper option in a heart beat if it existed. Does not exist and not a thing I can do about it. We all have to look around and pick our poison and try to find an acceptable spot for our players. It is not like the choices are good.

What is good is the sport of soccer. Good thing for the soccer industrial complex that the game is so great or everyone would quit this crap tomorrow.

This sounds more like a B/C-D level team issue.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I said in the post that it was a simplistic example used to make the point. Read it again. Just forget it and move on to the other example of not reviewing the written information and diagrams before practice.

We know your kid is super special and super dedicated. Oh, dear, where can she ever play with kids worthy of her acumen?

Yo can argue till kingdom come that lots of these "elite" teams in these "elite" leagues have the roster depth to successfully appreciate, learn and execute higher level strategies but that wont make it true. Anyone with a teen out here in the trenches can see the dilution for themselves. You can continue this dumb argument solo.

I'm not arguing that there is talent depth. What I am saying is that there are a lot of very average soccer players out there currently and that it is possible that your kid is simply just above average. I don't mean this as an insult just that we have a perspective of what "elite" is supposed to mean. And even though you are simply providing simple examples to make your point frankly, any example you can give just about any player at nearly any level in Europe or South America can execute as a bare minimum. the only real difference is the general pace of play.

Culturally we just don't really know how to play the game. We have lots of kids who can demonstrate the moves but we have very few multi generational players who just simply understand the game.

My point is, this is why our nets need to be cast as wide as possible to keep as many kids as possible playing the game as long as possible. If your kid is truly elite, yes, she may be held back some but in a relative sense it won't really matter.

Why would you compare youth soccer here to other places..it is fundamentally different. Show me a place where the families fork over thousands of dollars er year for soccer instruction, hotels, rental cars, plane tickets, etc and then we can make a comparison.

Never said my kid was going pro. I said that half the team does not even bother to come to practice prepared to learn. Problem has gotten worse with the complete over saturation of "elite" youth soccer options. I have a girl so this is just a total mess. At least boy in some areas in the right talent and location could play for a funded BDA. For girls the market was always for kids with some talent and the budgets to spend on developing it. There are no options is for girls that just have talent. They are of no value at all in this system.

I would go to a more inclusive, low travel cheaper option in a heart beat if it existed. Does not exist and not a thing I can do about it. We all have to look around and pick our poison and try to find an acceptable spot for our players. It is not like the choices are good.

What is good is the sport of soccer. Good thing for the soccer industrial complex that the game is so great or everyone would quit this crap tomorrow.

This sounds more like a B/C-D level team issue.

Then you need to pay more attention.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I said in the post that it was a simplistic example used to make the point. Read it again. Just forget it and move on to the other example of not reviewing the written information and diagrams before practice.

We know your kid is super special and super dedicated. Oh, dear, where can she ever play with kids worthy of her acumen?

Yo can argue till kingdom come that lots of these "elite" teams in these "elite" leagues have the roster depth to successfully appreciate, learn and execute higher level strategies but that wont make it true. Anyone with a teen out here in the trenches can see the dilution for themselves. You can continue this dumb argument solo.

I'm not arguing that there is talent depth. What I am saying is that there are a lot of very average soccer players out there currently and that it is possible that your kid is simply just above average. I don't mean this as an insult just that we have a perspective of what "elite" is supposed to mean. And even though you are simply providing simple examples to make your point frankly, any example you can give just about any player at nearly any level in Europe or South America can execute as a bare minimum. the only real difference is the general pace of play.

Culturally we just don't really know how to play the game. We have lots of kids who can demonstrate the moves but we have very few multi generational players who just simply understand the game.

My point is, this is why our nets need to be cast as wide as possible to keep as many kids as possible playing the game as long as possible. If your kid is truly elite, yes, she may be held back some but in a relative sense it won't really matter.

Why would you compare youth soccer here to other places..it is fundamentally different. Show me a place where the families fork over thousands of dollars er year for soccer instruction, hotels, rental cars, plane tickets, etc and then we can make a comparison.

Never said my kid was going pro. I said that half the team does not even bother to come to practice prepared to learn. Problem has gotten worse with the complete over saturation of "elite" youth soccer options. I have a girl so this is just a total mess. At least boy in some areas in the right talent and location could play for a funded BDA. For girls the market was always for kids with some talent and the budgets to spend on developing it. There are no options is for girls that just have talent. They are of no value at all in this system.

I would go to a more inclusive, low travel cheaper option in a heart beat if it existed. Does not exist and not a thing I can do about it. We all have to look around and pick our poison and try to find an acceptable spot for our players. It is not like the choices are good.

What is good is the sport of soccer. Good thing for the soccer industrial complex that the game is so great or everyone would quit this crap tomorrow.

This sounds more like a B/C-D level team issue.

Then you need to pay more attention.

Then perhaps you just need to change sports.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I said in the post that it was a simplistic example used to make the point. Read it again. Just forget it and move on to the other example of not reviewing the written information and diagrams before practice.

We know your kid is super special and super dedicated. Oh, dear, where can she ever play with kids worthy of her acumen?

Yo can argue till kingdom come that lots of these "elite" teams in these "elite" leagues have the roster depth to successfully appreciate, learn and execute higher level strategies but that wont make it true. Anyone with a teen out here in the trenches can see the dilution for themselves. You can continue this dumb argument solo.

I'm not arguing that there is talent depth. What I am saying is that there are a lot of very average soccer players out there currently and that it is possible that your kid is simply just above average. I don't mean this as an insult just that we have a perspective of what "elite" is supposed to mean. And even though you are simply providing simple examples to make your point frankly, any example you can give just about any player at nearly any level in Europe or South America can execute as a bare minimum. the only real difference is the general pace of play.

Culturally we just don't really know how to play the game. We have lots of kids who can demonstrate the moves but we have very few multi generational players who just simply understand the game.

My point is, this is why our nets need to be cast as wide as possible to keep as many kids as possible playing the game as long as possible. If your kid is truly elite, yes, she may be held back some but in a relative sense it won't really matter.

Why would you compare youth soccer here to other places..it is fundamentally different. Show me a place where the families fork over thousands of dollars er year for soccer instruction, hotels, rental cars, plane tickets, etc and then we can make a comparison.

Never said my kid was going pro. I said that half the team does not even bother to come to practice prepared to learn. Problem has gotten worse with the complete over saturation of "elite" youth soccer options. I have a girl so this is just a total mess. At least boy in some areas in the right talent and location could play for a funded BDA. For girls the market was always for kids with some talent and the budgets to spend on developing it. There are no options is for girls that just have talent. They are of no value at all in this system.

I would go to a more inclusive, low travel cheaper option in a heart beat if it existed. Does not exist and not a thing I can do about it. We all have to look around and pick our poison and try to find an acceptable spot for our players. It is not like the choices are good.

What is good is the sport of soccer. Good thing for the soccer industrial complex that the game is so great or everyone would quit this crap tomorrow.

This sounds more like a B/C-D level team issue.

Then you need to pay more attention.

Then perhaps you just need to change sports.

No thanks.