Level IV center schools in Fairfax County question

[Anonymous]

I'm not in Fairfax but am trying to understand how the program works for kids who are identified as in need of Level IV services (I think this is like TAG or GT in other school districts.)

Let's say you have a child in third grade who has been indentified as needing Level IV services. She can either gett hem in one of the 24 "Center" schools OR get Level IV services locally in her own school -- IF her school has the local services.

Correct?

If you the parent want her to go to a center school -- are there any space limitations at the schools? Or is she guaranteed a seat if you want the center, not the local services? Is there a lottery of any kind for seats in the center program?

Thanks!

[Anonymous]

If your kids qualifies, they are guaranteed a spot at the GT Center. If your school has a Local Level IV, they have a choice, and you can even change your mind year to year. This year we are at our base school for LLIV but are considering the GT Center for next year.

[Anonymous]

My DC is in 3rd grade and there are Local Level IV services at our base school. However, only a small number of students were found to be Center-eligible so we opted to go to the Center for 3rd grade. It was the Best Decision! My DC is in a classroom filled **with true peers** and is the happiest we have ever seen at school.

The choice between Local Level IV and a Center needs to be based on the child and for both academic AND social reasons.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:If your kids qualifies, they are guaranteed a spot at the GT Center. If your school has a Local Level IV, they have a choice, and you can even change your mind year to year. This year we are at our base school for LLIV but are considering the GT Center for next year.

Do you know the school district is able to guarantee that? Do they have some kind of flexible staffing ratios to allow for them to be able to guarantee placement in a particular program at the school?

[Anonymous]

Sorry -- I meant "Do you know HOW they are able to guarantee that?"

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Sorry -- I meant "Do you know HOW they are able to guarantee that?"

http://www.fcps.edu/DIS/gt/level4.html#anchor-overview

[Anonymous]

Well, some of the GT centers are in fact very crowded. And next year it may be even worse since FCPS is planning to increase the student-teacher ratio in the GT programs even higher than for the gen ed classrooms. One reason we chose to stay at our Local Level IV is that the classes have an average of 22ish kids per class vs almost 30 in our GT center.

Our school is only in it's second year of LLIV, and I know that last year only about half the class was GT eligible kids, but this year it is almost all GT eligible kids. And FYI, GT center classes may also have non-GT eligible kids in them too, so that is no guarantee. The principal has the ultimate discretion on how to fill those classes.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Well, some of the GT centers are in fact very crowded.

Not all. My DC's 3rd grade GT center class has 18 students.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
Let's say you have a child in third grade who has been indentified as needing Level IV services. She can either gett hem in one of the 24 "Center" schools OR get Level IV services locally in her own school -- IF her school has the local services.

The parent has the choice between the two -- if the Level IV services are offered at the base school.

Also, Assistant Superintendent Peter Noonan has stated several times that the "intended curriculum" is the same at the base school as at the Center -- but parents have posted on the FCAG Yahoo group time and time again that the "intended curriculum" is not the same. Almost without exception, the rigor is at the Center and not at the base school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Well, some of the GT centers are in fact very crowded. And next year it may be even worse since FCPS is planning to increase the student-teacher ratio in the GT programs even higher than for the gen ed classrooms. One reason we chose to stay at our Local Level IV is that the classes have an average of 22ish kids per class vs almost 30 in our GT center.

OK, that's what I figured. I couldn't figure out how the school district could guarantee center school for all kids who qualified and wanted it -- but if they just keep adding staff (at whatever ratio is decided) then that is how they are doing it.

They aren't saying, "There are only 90 spaces at the school for 3rd graders qualifying for Level IV services, so we need a lottery to decide who gets them." (Which is what happens in many school districts). THey find out how many kids qualify and want the school, and then assign staff based on the ratio.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
Our school is only in it's second year of LLIV, and I know that last year only about half the class was GT eligible kids, but this year it is almost all GT eligible kids.

Yes, the criteria for "GT eligible" has been broadened so that now over 15% of kids are found eligible.

[Anonymous]

That doesn't sound so outrageous -- isn't it some 40% in Montgomery County now?

[Anonymous]

Yes, the criteria for "GT eligible" has been broadened so that now over 15% of kids are found eligible.

Well, be that as it may, that actually isn't what I was referring to.

In many schools (GT center or LLIV), there may not be enough GT eligible kids to make an entire class (or to have relatively balanced class sizes across a grade level). In my school last year, 22 kids were GT eligible. Of those, 2 went to the GT center and the rest stayed at the base school. Two kids came in new to the school from private schools. So there were 22 GT eligible kids. But my DD's class has 24 kids. So the principal decided to add 2 kids to her class who were not GT eligible. The year before, only 16 kids from my school were GT eligible, and that year's GT classroom had 21 kids. So the principal added 5 kids to the GT class that year.

This is done at ALL the Local Level IV programs to balance the class sizes. It is also done at GT Centers, so they are not immune.

[Anonymous]

It is also done at GT Centers, so they are not immune.

I'm not so sure about that. I have never heard of non-eligible kids being placed in the GT center to balance out class sizes. I think they shift the class sizes around in other ways, but I don't think they move children from the base school into the GT classes in a GT Center school. (I know it's done at local Level IV schools, but they often don't have enough kids to make up a full GT class.)

My DD is in a GT Center. Last year in 3rd grade, we had 4 GT classes of 25ish kids. This year, the numbers have shifted and there are only 3 4th grade GT classes, but each has 30+ kids. So they adjust the numbers/class sizes that way, but I don't think they move kids from the base school into the Center - I have never heard of that in our school, at least.

[Anonymous]

I'm not so sure about that. I have never heard of non-eligible kids being placed in the GT center to balance out class sizes. I think they shift the class sizes around in other ways, but I don't think they move children from the base school into the GT classes in a GT Center school. (I know it's done at local Level IV schools, but they often don't have enough kids to make up a full GT class.)

This is absolutely done in GT centers. It probably isn't as prevalent, but it is done. It's been discussed many times on the FCAG list. Not even all GT Centers have the numbers to support 2 full classes per grade level. Many of the larger, more established GT Centers (like Louise Archer, Churchill, etc.) have several full classes per grade level, but many of the smaller centers struggle with some of the same issues as LLIV classes. And there are also LLIV programs that are as large as some GT Centers. You need to look at your particular LLIV school and GT Center because they are all quite different from one another.