How to appeal CES decision

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This was pre covid, so take it with a grain of salt, but I filed an appeal and wrote a letter explaining my child’s traits that made the CES a good fit for them, and I included a writing sample my child had written for fun. It really showcased DC’s creativity, vocabulary and passion for writing. The appeal was successful and DC was then placed in the waitpool. IMO, the writing sample probably had more sway than my letter, but I guess I’ll never know for sure. DC’s number was later randomly chosen and DC was admitted to the CES and did well there. Good luck.

Had a similar experience where dc should have been in the pool but was not. His test scores were all well within the range. I believe he was blackballed by administration. Wrote a letter of appeal. He was moved to wait list and accepted. It made an enormous difference in his subsequent academic career.

How much of a subsequent academic career could a 6th grader have had? They didn’t use the lottery pool method for any students older than the current 6th grade.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This was pre covid, so take it with a grain of salt, but I filed an appeal and wrote a letter explaining my child’s traits that made the CES a good fit for them, and I included a writing sample my child had written for fun. It really showcased DC’s creativity, vocabulary and passion for writing. The appeal was successful and DC was then placed in the waitpool. IMO, the writing sample probably had more sway than my letter, but I guess I’ll never know for sure. DC’s number was later randomly chosen and DC was admitted to the CES and did well there. Good luck.

There was no lottery pre-covid for CES so this doesn’t make any sense. This year’s 7th graders were selected for CES in Spring 2020 not by lottery. This year’s 6th graders were the first kids to be selected by lottery into CES in 2021, which was not pre covid.

I think PP means that their child went into the waitpool and was selected. MCPS hasn't always been clear, but the CES waitpool may not have been ranked. That is, it was a "lottery" off the waitpool even pre-covid. So, the first round was hand-picked but all subsequent rounds were random from the waitpool.

[Anonymous]

Different poster here, though I posted in another thread on this topic. I also have a kid with above grade level reading, 97% MAP score, and straight As. Apparently that didn't meet criteria for central review. Oh, and he has a 504 so theoretically the locally normed 85th percentile thing doesn't even apply to him anyway.

I asked the guidance counselor. She said she didn't know anything about it and referred me to the school reading specialist.

School reading specialist just reiterated that he didn't meet central criteria but cited the criteria for GT classification. When he was screened in 2nd grade for GT classification, he did poorly on the DIBELS. I thought criteria for ELC/CES are based on third grade performance, which he should have been included in the lottery pool.

I concluded that nobody at MCPS really knows what they're doing. In light of that information, I decided that I wasn't going to bother with ELC/CES classification or whatever. He has intelligent parents who like to read, do I really need MCPS to arbitrarily assign a classification to encourage habits that I can encourage at home anyway?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Different poster here, though I posted in another thread on this topic. I also have a kid with above grade level reading, 97% MAP score, and straight As. Apparently that didn't meet criteria for central review. Oh, and he has a 504 so theoretically the locally normed 85th percentile thing doesn't even apply to him anyway.

I asked the guidance counselor. She said she didn't know anything about it and referred me to the school reading specialist.

School reading specialist just reiterated that he didn't meet central criteria but cited the criteria for GT classification. When he was screened in 2nd grade for GT classification, he did poorly on the DIBELS. I thought criteria for ELC/CES are based on third grade performance, which he should have been included in the lottery pool.

I concluded that nobody at MCPS really knows what they're doing. In light of that information, I decided that I wasn't going to bother with ELC/CES classification or whatever. He has intelligent parents who like to read, do I really need MCPS to arbitrarily assign a classification to encourage habits that I can encourage at home anyway?

Some know, some don't, and upper admin has disfavored GT-oriented programs, so they don't do even the MCPS-standard poor job of communicating for common understanding (it's not that information isn't available, they just don't make sure it's ingested/understood across locals and related programs).

If your DC had those indicators for the second quarter & winter MAP-R (not MAP-M), and a 504, you could appeal (e.g., if the local failed to note/central failed to account for the 504). MCPS DCCAPS shpuld be able to tell you which of the particular criteria were missed if your readimg specialist can't.

Though one might think they are related, CES lottery pool placement amd SIPPI (GT designation) are kept separate. If your DC might benefit from ELC, even if not placed in the local CES (same lottery criteria, but a higher seat-to-catchment-population ratio), you could have a conversation with the school admin, usually May/June as they begin to plan out class logistics.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Different poster here, though I posted in another thread on this topic. I also have a kid with above grade level reading, 97% MAP score, and straight As. Apparently that didn't meet criteria for central review. Oh, and he has a 504 so theoretically the locally normed 85th percentile thing doesn't even apply to him anyway.

I asked the guidance counselor. She said she didn't know anything about it and referred me to the school reading specialist.

School reading specialist just reiterated that he didn't meet central criteria but cited the criteria for GT classification. When he was screened in 2nd grade for GT classification, he did poorly on the DIBELS. I thought criteria for ELC/CES are based on third grade performance, which he should have been included in the lottery pool.

I concluded that nobody at MCPS really knows what they're doing. In light of that information, I decided that I wasn't going to bother with ELC/CES classification or whatever. He has intelligent parents who like to read, do I really need MCPS to arbitrarily assign a classification to encourage habits that I can encourage at home anyway?

You’re asking the wrong people who are just guessing. You need to contact the correct central office who will tell you exactly why he didn’t qualify.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Different poster here, though I posted in another thread on this topic. I also have a kid with above grade level reading, 97% MAP score, and straight As. Apparently that didn't meet criteria for central review. Oh, and he has a 504 so theoretically the locally normed 85th percentile thing doesn't even apply to him anyway.

I asked the guidance counselor. She said she didn't know anything about it and referred me to the school reading specialist.

School reading specialist just reiterated that he didn't meet central criteria but cited the criteria for GT classification. When he was screened in 2nd grade for GT classification, he did poorly on the DIBELS. I thought criteria for ELC/CES are based on third grade performance, which he should have been included in the lottery pool.

I concluded that nobody at MCPS really knows what they're doing. In light of that information, I decided that I wasn't going to bother with ELC/CES classification or whatever. He has intelligent parents who like to read, do I really need MCPS to arbitrarily assign a classification to encourage habits that I can encourage at home anyway?

You’re asking the wrong people who are just guessing. You need to contact the correct central office who will tell you exactly why he didn’t qualify.

And central office needs to specify the criteria met/not met during central review (3 columns in notification letter -- criterion category/target for pool inclusion/student data), specitlfy the reasons for accepting/rejecting appeals (point for point with the appeal), and make the specifics of the criteria (e.g., local norms by tranche, ES list by FARMS-rate tranche, specific adjustments for any special populations) & associated justification/reasoning widely available prior to the beginning of any period during which the criteria-related data would be collected. Then we wouldn't have these questions.

[Anonymous]

There is also teacher input that goes into lottery decision.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Different poster here, though I posted in another thread on this topic. I also have a kid with above grade level reading, 97% MAP score, and straight As. Apparently that didn't meet criteria for central review. Oh, and he has a 504 so theoretically the locally normed 85th percentile thing doesn't even apply to him anyway.

I asked the guidance counselor. She said she didn't know anything about it and referred me to the school reading specialist.

School reading specialist just reiterated that he didn't meet central criteria but cited the criteria for GT classification. When he was screened in 2nd grade for GT classification, he did poorly on the DIBELS. I thought criteria for ELC/CES are based on third grade performance, which he should have been included in the lottery pool.

I concluded that nobody at MCPS really knows what they're doing. In light of that information, I decided that I wasn't going to bother with ELC/CES classification or whatever. He has intelligent parents who like to read, do I really need MCPS to arbitrarily assign a classification to encourage habits that I can encourage at home anyway?

You’re asking the wrong people who are just guessing. You need to contact the correct central office who will tell you exactly why he didn’t qualify.

And central office needs to specify the criteria met/not met during central review (3 columns in notification letter -- criterion category/target for pool inclusion/student data), specitlfy the reasons for accepting/rejecting appeals (point for point with the appeal), and make the specifics of the criteria (e.g., local norms by tranche, ES list by FARMS-rate tranche, specific adjustments for any special populations) & associated justification/reasoning widely available prior to the beginning of any period during which the criteria-related data would be collected. Then we wouldn't have these questions.

If you contact them and tell them you are considering an appeal they will tell you exactly where your kid fell short. I know several people who have done this and in every case they were wrong and their child had not met the criteria.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:There is also teacher input that goes into lottery decision.

Not true.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There is also teacher input that goes into lottery decision.

Not true.

It is true. I used to be an MCPS teacher and scored students for the CES program many times

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There is also teacher input that goes into lottery decision.

Not true.

It is true. I used to be an MCPS teacher and scored students for the CES program many times

Teachers haven’t been involved in four years. Your experience is dated and no longer accurate.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There is also teacher input that goes into lottery decision.

Not true.

It is true. I used to be an MCPS teacher and scored students for the CES program many times

No it’s not true. It used to be true but it has not been for several years so your “used to be” experience is not relevant to what is happening today.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There is also teacher input that goes into lottery decision.

Not true.

It is true. I used to be an MCPS teacher and scored students for the CES program many times

No it’s not true. It used to be true but it has not been for several years so your “used to be” experience is not relevant to what is happening today.

It was LAST YEAR! I rated children for the program LAST YEAR. They definitely still have teachers rate the students across multiple points. Maybe they stopped telling wacko parents that it is part of the process. You know less than you pretend to know

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There is also teacher input that goes into lottery decision.

Not true.

It is true. I used to be an MCPS teacher and scored students for the CES program many times

No it’s not true. It used to be true but it has not been for several years so your “used to be” experience is not relevant to what is happening today.

It was LAST YEAR! I rated children for the program LAST YEAR. They definitely still have teachers rate the students across multiple points. Maybe they stopped telling wacko parents that it is part of the process. You know less than you pretend to know

DP. Tell us which school, if so. This is not at all a part of the current process, as communicated/understood/documented.

Separate from the CES lottery is SIPPI (GT identification), which does have teacher/staff input as one of the identifying parameters. Could you be thinking of that?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There is also teacher input that goes into lottery decision.

Not true.

It is true. I used to be an MCPS teacher and scored students for the CES program many times

No it’s not true. It used to be true but it has not been for several years so your “used to be” experience is not relevant to what is happening today.

It was LAST YEAR! I rated children for the program LAST YEAR. They definitely still have teachers rate the students across multiple points. Maybe they stopped telling wacko parents that it is part of the process. You know less than you pretend to know

DP. Tell us which school, if so. This is not at all a part of the current process, as communicated/understood/documented.

Separate from the CES lottery is SIPPI (GT identification), which does have teacher/staff input as one of the identifying parameters. Could you be thinking of that?

Nope. Wootton cluster for Cold Spring. All third grade teachers rated the kids with numbers across multiple areas last year 2023- 24. I'm sure they did it this year too. Even if it is a "lottery," they aren't going to choose kids who have low scores