Can someone explain the wealthy military officer phenomenon?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It’s not that they’re so wealthy. They’re more along the lines of lower end of UMC. They avoided a lot of debt due to military benefits. They’re not flying business class and sending kids to private school.

Yes they are. There are military schools that give scholarships to military children. Then they also get college free.

Where are all these military children getting free college? IF the parent has GI Bill benefits available and IF they transfer these to their child, they could have the benefit. But that assumes a few things. One, that they did not use the benefit themselves first. Two, that they want to incur the additional 6 year service obligation the transfer requires. Lastly, the benefit is capped and would really only cover a 4 year school for one child.


If military kids are widely getting college for free in other ways, please enlighten me. I’d love to know for the future!

The benefit is capped, can be split and gets any kid using it instate tuition


https://www.va.gov/resources/in-state-tuition-rates-under-the-veterans-choice-act/

Okay, so it can be split. How does that change the fact that it is capped and wouldn’t get more than one child though a 4 year school?

Sure, if everything lines up and the parent wants to invite the additional service obligation ONE kid could get their degree fully paid. But it’s certainly not as simple as proclaiming that “military children get free college.” That’s not true anywhere near universally.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It’s not that they’re so wealthy. They’re more along the lines of lower end of UMC. They avoided a lot of debt due to military benefits. They’re not flying business class and sending kids to private school.

Yes they are. There are military schools that give scholarships to military children. Then they also get college free.

Where are all these military children getting free college? IF the parent has GI Bill benefits available and IF they transfer these to their child, they could have the benefit. But that assumes a few things. One, that they did not use the benefit themselves first. Two, that they want to incur the additional 6 year service obligation the transfer requires. Lastly, the benefit is capped and would really only cover a 4 year school for one child.


If military kids are widely getting college for free in other ways, please enlighten me. I’d love to know for the future!

The benefit is capped, can be split and gets any kid using it instate tuition


https://www.va.gov/resources/in-state-tuition-rates-under-the-veterans-choice-act/

Okay, so it can be split. How does that change the fact that it is capped and wouldn’t get more than one child though a 4 year school?

Sure, if everything lines up and the parent wants to invite the additional service obligation ONE kid could get their degree fully paid. But it’s certainly not as simple as proclaiming that “military children get free college.” That’s not true anywhere near universally.

+1. Totally agree. The PP makes it sound like military children just walk up to registrar’s office and get their free college easy breezy. That’s not the way it works.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It’s not that they’re so wealthy. They’re more along the lines of lower end of UMC. They avoided a lot of debt due to military benefits. They’re not flying business class and sending kids to private school.

Yes they are. There are military schools that give scholarships to military children. Then they also get college free.

You're wrong, apart from being dumb.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It’s because the taxpayer funds a huge portion of their expenses (housing while on base, no down payment for Va loans, the list goes on). Welfare queens to the max

+1. Even one of Reagan's hires (Stockdale, I think his name may be) wrote a book a few years ago describing the US military as socialistic. But if you dare question it, you're labeled a "communist" or worse. DH has several retired military in his family, and when they start bragging about their free health care and whatnot at Thanksgiving, I say "you're welcome."

Maybe when the conversation turns to the safe and free society we live in, your retired military family members can turn to you and say, “You’re welcome.”

Oh, they do, at every turn.

Good, I’m glad you are making sure to thank them for their service.

You are thanking them, right, and that’s why they’re saying, “You’re welcome”?

Thanking them for their service is cringe. They didn’t do it for you.

This.

The elephant in the room is that many people join or stay in the military because it is their best (financial ) option.

That is not politically correct but it is true. (That is why they use bonuses to get them to re-up, not flags or the constitution!)

Come on. That's not true. Of all the officers that got to retirement there isn't a single one I know that did it for a paycheck. Many easier careers that don't totally burn your family and regularly puts you at risk.

My spouse and I both got out at 8 (dual military, both service academy graduates). The majority of our former peers that we know that are staying in until retirement are…very average. Many of them were open about staying in until retirement simply to get retirement pay. Nice people, but very average in intellect, skill, and ambition. This label is true for both the ROTC graduates and the service academy graduates that we know; only OCS and prior service officers defy this trend in my experience. They definitely don’t have many options for stable pay and benefits at the level that they have in the military, although laughably more than a few have commented that they could have been “CEO level” if they had gotten out pre or post company command. Their wives are also to this day, even post GWOT era, the most into the “I am a military spouse! Thank me and my family! We serve too!” culture, way more than the enlisted wives that I knew. There are of course exceptions to every generalization. A small minority are exceptional.

To be fair, officers' wives are typically more educated (like attracts like), so they do sacrifice more than the high school grad who marries her first boyfriend right after he graduates from basic. For the latter, the military lifestyle is a step up. For the former, it's forfeiting what could have been.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It’s not that they’re so wealthy. They’re more along the lines of lower end of UMC. They avoided a lot of debt due to military benefits. They’re not flying business class and sending kids to private school.

Yes they are. There are military schools that give scholarships to military children. Then they also get college free.

Where are all these military children getting free college? IF the parent has GI Bill benefits available and IF they transfer these to their child, they could have the benefit. But that assumes a few things. One, that they did not use the benefit themselves first. Two, that they want to incur the additional 6 year service obligation the transfer requires. Lastly, the benefit is capped and would really only cover a 4 year school for one child.


If military kids are widely getting college for free in other ways, please enlighten me. I’d love to know for the future!

IMO, it's short-sighted to use your the GI Bill for yourself when TA is available. We don't know anyone with < 18 year old children who's done it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It’s not that they’re so wealthy. They’re more along the lines of lower end of UMC. They avoided a lot of debt due to military benefits. They’re not flying business class and sending kids to private school.

Yes they are. There are military schools that give scholarships to military children. Then they also get college free.

Where are all these military children getting free college? IF the parent has GI Bill benefits available and IF they transfer these to their child, they could have the benefit. But that assumes a few things. One, that they did not use the benefit themselves first. Two, that they want to incur the additional 6 year service obligation the transfer requires. Lastly, the benefit is capped and would really only cover a 4 year school for one child.


If military kids are widely getting college for free in other ways, please enlighten me. I’d love to know for the future!

The benefit is capped, can be split and gets any kid using it instate tuition


https://www.va.gov/resources/in-state-tuition-rates-under-the-veterans-choice-act/

Okay, so it can be split. How does that change the fact that it is capped and wouldn’t get more than one child though a 4 year school?

Sure, if everything lines up and the parent wants to invite the additional service obligation ONE kid could get their degree fully paid. But it’s certainly not as simple as proclaiming that “military children get free college.” That’s not true anywhere near universally.

+1. Totally agree. The PP makes it sound like military children just walk up to registrar’s office and get their free college easy breezy. That’s not the way it works.

I mean, I was excited to hear about this mythical benefit I didn’t know existed. 🤣

[Anonymous]

I think it is behavioral selection due to the eligibility criteria to join the military to some extent. They need to have a decent aptitude score to become an officer and there are mental/physical health screenings that exclude many people who would otherwise be interested in the program. There are minimum SAT scores or ASVAB scores required to be eligible for the college based officer training program. So almost everyone starting in the military officer training programs have average or more(mostly above average intellectual ability) and they are in better physical/mental health than the average person. Then some of the people that do not pass the training program are weeded out. Furthermore, the remaining pool of people is going to skew towards higher achieving since their careers are less likely to be derailed by health issues. Their family backgrounds are also going to skew wealthier due to the correlation between mental/physical health and family income, as well as the wealth/income gradient with respect to intellectual ability.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It’s not that they’re so wealthy. They’re more along the lines of lower end of UMC. They avoided a lot of debt due to military benefits. They’re not flying business class and sending kids to private school.

Yes they are. There are military schools that give scholarships to military children. Then they also get college free.

Where are all these military children getting free college? IF the parent has GI Bill benefits available and IF they transfer these to their child, they could have the benefit. But that assumes a few things. One, that they did not use the benefit themselves first. Two, that they want to incur the additional 6 year service obligation the transfer requires. Lastly, the benefit is capped and would really only cover a 4 year school for one child.


If military kids are widely getting college for free in other ways, please enlighten me. I’d love to know for the future!

The benefit is capped, can be split and gets any kid using it instate tuition


https://www.va.gov/resources/in-state-tuition-rates-under-the-veterans-choice-act/

Okay, so it can be split. How does that change the fact that it is capped and wouldn’t get more than one child though a 4 year school?

Sure, if everything lines up and the parent wants to invite the additional service obligation ONE kid could get their degree fully paid. But it’s certainly not as simple as proclaiming that “military children get free college.” That’s not true anywhere near universally.

+1. Totally agree. The PP makes it sound like military children just walk up to registrar’s office and get their free college easy breezy. That’s not the way it works.

I mean, I was excited to hear about this mythical benefit I didn’t know existed. 🤣

A lot of black and white thinking here. The Post 9/11 GI Bill definitely can benefit children. Like anything else, if you're ignorant, or dismissive, or don't care, yeah, you can definitely f*ck it up. Saying it's "mythical" when it's clearly not is a good start.

Thank you for your service in destabilizing central Asia and the Levant.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It’s not that they’re so wealthy. They’re more along the lines of lower end of UMC. They avoided a lot of debt due to military benefits. They’re not flying business class and sending kids to private school.

Yes they are. There are military schools that give scholarships to military children. Then they also get college free.

Where are all these military children getting free college? IF the parent has GI Bill benefits available and IF they transfer these to their child, they could have the benefit. But that assumes a few things. One, that they did not use the benefit themselves first. Two, that they want to incur the additional 6 year service obligation the transfer requires. Lastly, the benefit is capped and would really only cover a 4 year school for one child.


If military kids are widely getting college for free in other ways, please enlighten me. I’d love to know for the future!

IMO, it's short-sighted to use your the GI Bill for yourself when TA is available. We don't know anyone with < 18 year old children who's done it.

I mean sure. I generally agree with you. But not everyone has kids by year 14 where you wouldn’t be incurring another x years past your 20. TA is capped per fiscal year and with deployments and such it’s not always super simple to be going to school and working at the same time. We’re kind of grappling with all this now and figuring out the best way to approach it.

There’s a lot that has to line up in order for it to work is my point.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It’s not that they’re so wealthy. They’re more along the lines of lower end of UMC. They avoided a lot of debt due to military benefits. They’re not flying business class and sending kids to private school.

Yes they are. There are military schools that give scholarships to military children. Then they also get college free.

Where are all these military children getting free college? IF the parent has GI Bill benefits available and IF they transfer these to their child, they could have the benefit. But that assumes a few things. One, that they did not use the benefit themselves first. Two, that they want to incur the additional 6 year service obligation the transfer requires. Lastly, the benefit is capped and would really only cover a 4 year school for one child.


If military kids are widely getting college for free in other ways, please enlighten me. I’d love to know for the future!

The benefit is capped, can be split and gets any kid using it instate tuition


https://www.va.gov/resources/in-state-tuition-rates-under-the-veterans-choice-act/

Okay, so it can be split. How does that change the fact that it is capped and wouldn’t get more than one child though a 4 year school?

Sure, if everything lines up and the parent wants to invite the additional service obligation ONE kid could get their degree fully paid. But it’s certainly not as simple as proclaiming that “military children get free college.” That’s not true anywhere near universally.

+1. Totally agree. The PP makes it sound like military children just walk up to registrar’s office and get their free college easy breezy. That’s not the way it works.

I mean, I was excited to hear about this mythical benefit I didn’t know existed. 🤣

It literally does, though. DH transferred his GI Bill to our oldest, who chose a service academy, so he transferred it again to our youngest, who's going for free. You're not making your case like you think you are.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It’s not that they’re so wealthy. They’re more along the lines of lower end of UMC. They avoided a lot of debt due to military benefits. They’re not flying business class and sending kids to private school.

Yes they are. There are military schools that give scholarships to military children. Then they also get college free.

Where are all these military children getting free college? IF the parent has GI Bill benefits available and IF they transfer these to their child, they could have the benefit. But that assumes a few things. One, that they did not use the benefit themselves first. Two, that they want to incur the additional 6 year service obligation the transfer requires. Lastly, the benefit is capped and would really only cover a 4 year school for one child.


If military kids are widely getting college for free in other ways, please enlighten me. I’d love to know for the future!

The benefit is capped, can be split and gets any kid using it instate tuition


https://www.va.gov/resources/in-state-tuition-rates-under-the-veterans-choice-act/

Okay, so it can be split. How does that change the fact that it is capped and wouldn’t get more than one child though a 4 year school?

Sure, if everything lines up and the parent wants to invite the additional service obligation ONE kid could get their degree fully paid. But it’s certainly not as simple as proclaiming that “military children get free college.” That’s not true anywhere near universally.

+1. Totally agree. The PP makes it sound like military children just walk up to registrar’s office and get their free college easy breezy. That’s not the way it works.

I mean, I was excited to hear about this mythical benefit I didn’t know existed. 🤣

A lot of black and white thinking here. The Post 9/11 GI Bill definitely can benefit children. Like anything else, if you're ignorant, or dismissive, or don't care, yeah, you can definitely f*ck it up. Saying it's "mythical" when it's clearly not is a good start.

Thank you for your service in destabilizing central Asia and the Levant.

I never said it couldn’t help. It absolutely can and it’s a great benefit if you are informed on how to take advantage of it. One of the best things the military offers to its service members with the soaring cost of education.

I was simply dispelling this notion that all military kids get free college.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It’s not that they’re so wealthy. They’re more along the lines of lower end of UMC. They avoided a lot of debt due to military benefits. They’re not flying business class and sending kids to private school.

Yes they are. There are military schools that give scholarships to military children. Then they also get college free.

Where are all these military children getting free college? IF the parent has GI Bill benefits available and IF they transfer these to their child, they could have the benefit. But that assumes a few things. One, that they did not use the benefit themselves first. Two, that they want to incur the additional 6 year service obligation the transfer requires. Lastly, the benefit is capped and would really only cover a 4 year school for one child.


If military kids are widely getting college for free in other ways, please enlighten me. I’d love to know for the future!

IMO, it's short-sighted to use your the GI Bill for yourself when TA is available. We don't know anyone with < 18 year old children who's done it.

I mean sure. I generally agree with you. But not everyone has kids by year 14 where you wouldn’t be incurring another x years past your 20. TA is capped per fiscal year and with deployments and such it’s not always super simple to be going to school and working at the same time. We’re kind of grappling with all this now and figuring out the best way to approach it.

There’s a lot that has to line up in order for it to work is my point.

Fair enough, but in general, even now, most people do have kids by 32 or 36. Hope you can figure out a good solution.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It’s because the taxpayer funds a huge portion of their expenses (housing while on base, no down payment for Va loans, the list goes on). Welfare queens to the max

+1. Even one of Reagan's hires (Stockdale, I think his name may be) wrote a book a few years ago describing the US military as socialistic. But if you dare question it, you're labeled a "communist" or worse. DH has several retired military in his family, and when they start bragging about their free health care and whatnot at Thanksgiving, I say "you're welcome."

Maybe when the conversation turns to the safe and free society we live in, your retired military family members can turn to you and say, “You’re welcome.”

Oh, they do, at every turn.

Good, I’m glad you are making sure to thank them for their service.

You are thanking them, right, and that’s why they’re saying, “You’re welcome”?

Thanking them for their service is cringe. They didn’t do it for you.

This.

The elephant in the room is that many people join or stay in the military because it is their best (financial ) option.

That is not politically correct but it is true. (That is why they use bonuses to get them to re-up, not flags or the constitution!)

Come on. That's not true. Of all the officers that got to retirement there isn't a single one I know that did it for a paycheck. Many easier careers that don't totally burn your family and regularly puts you at risk.

My spouse and I both got out at 8 (dual military, both service academy graduates). The majority of our former peers that we know that are staying in until retirement are…very average. Many of them were open about staying in until retirement simply to get retirement pay. Nice people, but very average in intellect, skill, and ambition. This label is true for both the ROTC graduates and the service academy graduates that we know; only OCS and prior service officers defy this trend in my experience. They definitely don’t have many options for stable pay and benefits at the level that they have in the military, although laughably more than a few have commented that they could have been “CEO level” if they had gotten out pre or post company command. Their wives are also to this day, even post GWOT era, the most into the “I am a military spouse! Thank me and my family! We serve too!” culture, way more than the enlisted wives that I knew. There are of course exceptions to every generalization. A small minority are exceptional.

To be fair, officers' wives are typically more educated (like attracts like), so they do sacrifice more than the high school grad who marries her first boyfriend right after he graduates from basic. For the latter, the military lifestyle is a step up. For the former, it's forfeiting what could have been.

They forfeit basically everything. Most of the officers that I know spent at least a decade moving every year and deploying. It's not the 3 year assignments many get towards the end and I'd you keep going to 06 and above the pace is every year you move.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It’s not that they’re so wealthy. They’re more along the lines of lower end of UMC. They avoided a lot of debt due to military benefits. They’re not flying business class and sending kids to private school.

Yes they are. There are military schools that give scholarships to military children. Then they also get college free.

Where are all these military children getting free college? IF the parent has GI Bill benefits available and IF they transfer these to their child, they could have the benefit. But that assumes a few things. One, that they did not use the benefit themselves first. Two, that they want to incur the additional 6 year service obligation the transfer requires. Lastly, the benefit is capped and would really only cover a 4 year school for one child.


If military kids are widely getting college for free in other ways, please enlighten me. I’d love to know for the future!

The benefit is capped, can be split and gets any kid using it instate tuition


https://www.va.gov/resources/in-state-tuition-rates-under-the-veterans-choice-act/

Okay, so it can be split. How does that change the fact that it is capped and wouldn’t get more than one child though a 4 year school?

Sure, if everything lines up and the parent wants to invite the additional service obligation ONE kid could get their degree fully paid. But it’s certainly not as simple as proclaiming that “military children get free college.” That’s not true anywhere near universally.

+1. Totally agree. The PP makes it sound like military children just walk up to registrar’s office and get their free college easy breezy. That’s not the way it works.

I mean, I was excited to hear about this mythical benefit I didn’t know existed. 🤣

It literally does, though. DH transferred his GI Bill to our oldest, who chose a service academy, so he transferred it again to our youngest, who's going for free. You're not making your case like you think you are.

I’m so happy that worked out for you. I would love for that to be the case for us, too. I think it’s fair to say a lot of things had to line up and it’s not a universal truth. That’s the only point I was attempting (maybe poorly) to make.

[Anonymous]

They could actually come from an old money family, some of them especially from the South value military service.