Woman moves from Illinois to Texas and ends up dead in jail cell

[Anonymous]

The one time we got pulled over in TX, my dh was asked to get out of the car and was taken to the back of the car and "questioned". The officer then came around to me and asked the same questions. It was nighttime and not on a main highway so it was definitely nerve wracking but you better believe we were both polite as hell, even if a bit confused. The officer ended up being really nice in the end. We, however, are white so have no understanding how an AA would feel about the same situation.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't know how to say this without sounding like a real c*nt, but I'm saying it anyway. When he asked her to put out the cigarette, why was she so pissy and disrespectful? Did I miss part of the video, was he hateful to her first. We all know most cops are arrogant assholes. But we don't have to be belligerent back. Just do what they say and no one gets hurt.

+1

I agree. I actually think he seems pretty decent toward her, up until the point where she gets pissy and doesn't comply. He is quite friendly and courteous to the previous person he had pulled over as well. He didn't ask her to get out of the car over the traffic infraction, it was because she started in with the attitude and noncompliance. Not at all saying she deserved to die, who knows what happened once she got to the jail. But as far as what transpired at the traffic stop -- it all could have been avoided if she had put out her cigarette when asked (not an unreasonable request in my opinion).

She was pissy because he set her up. He pulled her over because she moved to get out of his way (but didn't signal when she did it). It was an egregious show of power on his part. Pulling up behind her so that she'd move over and then putting on his lights when she did so but didn't signal. Yeah, that'd piss me off. This is all clear from the beginning of the video. It's not like she was weaving in and out of traffic without signaling, or cutting in front of someone or doing anything else dangerous.

[Anonymous]

Here's a video from the incident:

http://insider.foxnews.com/2015/07/22/dash-cam-video-released-sandra-bland-arrest

She's asking why she is being apprehended. Aren't we allowed to ask that? I've read that we can ask "am I being detained"? And they should tell you yes or no. If no, you can leave.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The one time we got pulled over in TX, my dh was asked to get out of the car and was taken to the back of the car and "questioned". The officer then came around to me and asked the same questions. It was nighttime and not on a main highway so it was definitely nerve wracking but you better believe we were both polite as hell, even if a bit confused. The officer ended up being really nice in the end. We, however, are white so have no understanding how an AA would feel about the same situation.

White lady here, the cop was also probably nicer to you than he would be to a black person.

[Anonymous]

Holy Smokes. White woman here. If I had acted the way she acted when the cop was polite at first and she was b***h, I would most certainly have expected the cop to try to find a way to get the upper hand in this situation. I only heard the start of the video last night, didn't see it, and don't completely recall what she had in her hand besides a cigarette, was it a cell phone? I have been pulled over enough to know you get more flies with honey than with vinegar. What right did she have to disrespect him? You want respect, act like you deserve it. I am white, and I say "sir" and "ma'am" to cops because it is polite and deferential to the person in authority. This is good policy regardless of your skin color, and especially if you did violate (albeit a minor) traffic law. Why does this woman get a pass on being respectful?

Seriously, the cop had a right to conduct a traffic stop and ask her hands to be empty. She has a right to say no, but then he still has her on a traffic violation and he can act accordingly. At some point she is resisting his enforcing the law. She escalated first, not him. Is he supposed to let her go at that stage? Reminds me of how teachers aren't allow any good way to discipline kids in the classroom. Does no one respect rules anymore?

I am sorry to hear she died. I'd expect because she is black this is all going to get blown up in the media and any investigation will be doubted. Maybe she just wanted to have her name remembered and knew it would because of the circumstances.

[Anonymous]

So this likely wouldn't have happened if the officer had said, I understand your frustration. I hear that you were caught behind that driver, but I have no choice but to give you a ticket. If you disagree with the ticket you can refute it in traffic court. I hope the rest of your day is better. If the smoking was really bothering him he could have said, I'd really appreciate it if you'd put out your cigarette. The smoke is bothering me and I'm required to stand next to your car when writing the ticket. (Which is probably not true and I do wonder why he told her to put out her cigarette except as a power play).
Bottom line, he could have pretty easily de-escalated this. Why wasn't he trained to? Why aren't police trained to acknowledge people's frustrations and not "co-tantrum."

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:So this likely wouldn't have happened if the officer had said, I understand your frustration. I hear that you were caught behind that driver, but I have no choice but to give you a ticket. If you disagree with the ticket you can refute it in traffic court. I hope the rest of your day is better. If the smoking was really bothering him he could have said, I'd really appreciate it if you'd put out your cigarette. The smoke is bothering me and I'm required to stand next to your car when writing the ticket. (Which is probably not true and I do wonder why he told her to put out her cigarette except as a power play).
Bottom line, he could have pretty easily de-escalated this. Why wasn't he trained to? Why aren't police trained to acknowledge people's frustrations and not "co-tantrum."

This

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Wow! As a AA woman. I'm afraid. Slippery slope. I feel as if we are the next target.

I think if everyone regardless of color didn't fight or be combative to police everything would be better.

-not white

[Anonymous]

Someone needs to go back to the old school and show this to their children

[Anonymous]

Here's the full dashcam

http://boingboing.net/2015/07/21/sandrabland.html

So he asks her why she's irritated, she tells him. You can tell he's pissed.

Then she refuses to put her cigarette out. That's when he goes off on her.

She was unpleasant but he was unprofessional. He's the worse offender IMO.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't know how to say this without sounding like a real c*nt, but I'm saying it anyway. When he asked her to put out the cigarette, why was she so pissy and disrespectful? Did I miss part of the video, was he hateful to her first. We all know most cops are arrogant assholes. But we don't have to be belligerent back. Just do what they say and no one gets hurt.

So it's okay for the police to attack you for smoking in your car. Wow. WTF has happened to people in this country?

It's always the initial action that the defenders revert back to. NO, it's not ok to be attacked for smoking in your car. NO, it's not ok to be killed for stealing a bag of chips. But, she wasn't attacked for smoking in her car. She reacted in such a hostile way, she escalated everything. Do you actually excuse (and endorse) the blatant disrespect and anti-authoritarian stance she took?

He is a trained police officer. No matter how much of an ass the citizen is, he should be capable of restraint.

If my kid is an ass to his teacher, I don't expect the teacher to beat him, no matter how much my kid is "asking for it". Trained professionals are expected to maintain a higher standard.

He should have written her a ticket for the failure to signal and sent her on her way.

By your logic, anything the cop asks you to do during a traffic stop, you should just do, because it's not worth getting killed over.

Cops are not God. We have a right and even a responsibility to stand up for our rights. We should not have to cower before policemen because if we don't,they might kill us.

It's not illegal to be hostile or a jerk or disrespectful. I agree, it's not wise and I don't endorse it. But average citizens should not end up dead for being jerks.

Cops should be better than that.

Frankly I can't believe people are actually excusing, and endorsing, a citizen ending up dead because she was (you say) nasty to a cop.

I am astounded that people can't admit that she should have kept her flippin' mouth shut. Believe it or not, one can RESPECTFULLY stand up for his rights. Hateful comebacks and outright refusal to comply with a normal request is not standing up for rights, it's just being aggressive to rebel. I totally agree this cop is a creep. He way overdid it - and however she died, it's a horrible, horrible and undeserved result. I can admit he went overboard, but unfortunately when you push and test your limits with an a-hole, you're going to get sh*t on.

NP - seriously? Why is it a "normal request" to insist that she put out a cigarette that she is legally smoking in her own car? I'm not a smoker but I know how addictive it can be. She clearly wanted to smoke the rest of that cigarette (perhaps it was her last?) and who is he to say that she shouldn't. [/b] And she is perfectly right that he has NO RIGHT to insist that she step out of the car for a jumped up charge of failing to signal. [b] She was absolutely completely in the right when he asked her why she was upset and she said that she was upset because he sped up close behind her, so she moved out of his way (which is an utterly normal response to a cop who is driving aggressively behind you) and then, because she was helpful and tried to do what she THOUGHT he wanted her to do, he stops her and tries to ticket her for not having signaled. Give me a break. He intentionally set her up, 100 percent. On the whole, I wish people would signal more and drive more considerately, but she was not being inconsiderate when she switched lanes and nothing she did was dangerous. She did not deserve a ticket, it was not a lawful traffic stop and he had no right to insist she put out her cigarette, get out of the car, or be arrested. I mean, WTF, he essentially arrested her for "resisting arrest", how bullshit is that?

I remember being pulled over for a taillight violation. The officer asked me to step out of the car. I said, I want to make a 911 call. The officer said why, I told him "it's nighttime, I want this on record". He let me go with a verbal warning. She had every right to question him.

[Anonymous]

Sounds like she had prior mental issues.

[Anonymous]

Cop's bosses officially say HE was in the wrong:

Trooper Brian Encinia, has been put on administrative leave after a preliminary investigation found he violated the Texas Department of Public Safety’s traffic stop and courtesy procedures during the stop, which was for an improper lane change.
“Regardless of the situation, the DPS state trooper has an obligation to exhibit professionalism and be courteous,” DPS Director Steve McCraw told the Washington Post. “That did not happen in this situation.”

After watching the dashcam video, Texas State Senator Royce West said at a press conference that it’s clear she never should have been arrested.

http://heavy.com/news/2015/07/brian-encinia-texas-state-trooper-waller-county-officer-cop-arrested-sandra-sandy-bland-traffic-stop-video-arrest-investigation-desk-duty-fired-charges-wrongdoing-photo-age-experience/

I hope her family takes them to the cleaners.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

There are two different things here. First, would it have been wiser for Sandra Bland to have been compliant and subdued and not acted annoyed and put out her cigarette when the cop asked her to? Obviously, yes because then maybe she wouldn't have ended up dead! (MAYBE. Of course many black Americans in recent times have been murdered by the police with less "provocation" than this.)

Separately, was she morally and legally justified in acting annoyed, refusing to put the cigarette out, asking why she was being asked to get out of the car and then arrested? YES!

On the other hand, was the cop justified in ANYTHING he did starting with asking her to put her cigarette out? NO! He had no right to ask her to do that. No reason to tell her to get out of the car. No legal reason to arrest her. Absolutely no reason to become physical with her, threaten to "light her up," hurt her while handcuffing her, tell her it was "good" she had epilepsy (!), and, it seems quite likely, ultimately participate in killing her.

This is the same reason many black parents tell their children to act hyper-respectful and subservient towards cops so they don't get killed. That is good advice given the reality of the world we live in and the apparently horrible state of police training and racism. But it SHOULD NOT be necessary. The police should not be arresting or beating or killing people for talking back or acting annoyed or asking valid questions. That this is even a point that needs to be argued is amazing!

Btw i am white and have never experienced anything like this video. It is so far out of my experience with the police I can't even say. I am almost never pulled over, have gotten a ticket only once even though I have deserved it many more times, and have NEVER been asked to leave my car. The foreignness of it is what makes me feel like, well it also seems crazy that the police would murder this woman in her jail cell, but given how the cop acted in the video, I have to think it's possible.

I can't even imagine the pain that Sandra's family and friends are experiencing.

This. He was pissy because she didn't "respect his authority." So what? Grow up, you big baby! He was exceeding his legal authority and didn't like that she wasn't subservient and compliant. So he wrongly arrested her. Oh, and edited or had someone edit that video, which STILL shows him in a terrible light.

The amount of authoritarianism on this board is terrifying. The idea that we must be totally subservient to the cops and kowtow to their power trips or they are somehow justified in arresting, beating, or killing us is so foreign to the idea of the rule of law it's not on the same planet. It is police who have an obligation to protect and serve the citizens of this country, not the other way around.

[Anonymous]

Petition for Sandra Bland:

https://www.change.org/p/the-united-states-department-of-justice-attorney-general-loretta-lynch-take-over-the-investigation-into-the-death-of-sandra-bland-from-the-waller-county-texas-police-department?just_created=true