HYP and Oxbridge: Are students taught differently?

[Anonymous]

Given the very high quality of students overall, how does this reflect in the curriculum? Some cynics say it's mostly about the connections because the undergraduate curriculum is the same at most institutions of reasonable quality. But I would suspect since there's no remedial education going, there's a difference in kind between a bachelor's from HYP/Oxbridge and your more typical bachelor's degree.

[Anonymous]

Oxbridge has a higher floor but lower ceiling. This is due to the stricter requirements, whereas HYP students can enroll in upper level undergrad courses and even graduate courses their freshman year

[Anonymous]

There's also the tutorial system

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Oxbridge has a higher floor but lower ceiling. This is due to the stricter requirements, whereas HYP students can enroll in upper level undergrad courses and even graduate courses their freshman year

Upper level courses aren’t necessary “harder”, they are often just more specific. The toughest courses are often lower to mid-level “weed out” classes. The US History survey course was harder to do well in than the course on the Jazz Age, or the one on Vietnam era.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:There's also the tutorial system

Possibly this is the biggest difference.

[Anonymous]

Yes, taught differently. Less hand holding at Oxford. What the student gets out of the experience is more student driven at Oxford. In US students attend lectures and take multiple tests. At Oxford students need to demonstrate actual understanding.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Given the very high quality of students overall, how does this reflect in the curriculum? Some cynics say it's mostly about the connections because the undergraduate curriculum is the same at most institutions of reasonable quality. But I would suspect since there's no remedial education going, there's a difference in kind between a bachelor's from HYP/Oxbridge and your more typical bachelor's degree.

You think that any uni that is not one of these 5 has widespread remedial ed? FWIW, there are lots of “remedial” classes at HYP to bolster writing, math skills, etc.

Assessments in the US are ongoing while less frequent in UK higher ed. The latter students must exert a lot of self discipline to ensure that they can pass from one year to the next.

[Anonymous]

Oxbridge classes are mandatory first year and all of second year, that is, there is little flexibility to choose courses, even within one’s major (which we know is all that’s studied at Oxbridge). Oxbridge does not care about placement if a kid is more advanced: everyone is in the same boat.

Oxbridge is only 24 weeks a year, as opposed to 30-32 weeks in America.

Yes, Oxbridge will have tutorials, but lots of lectures have to be attended as well. Tutorials are with lesser professors.

[Anonymous]

Not sure if it’s about remedial education, but yes, there is a difference in the education you get at this level. But I don’t think HYP and Oxbridge are the only schools at this level.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Given the very high quality of students overall, how does this reflect in the curriculum? Some cynics say it's mostly about the connections because the undergraduate curriculum is the same at most institutions of reasonable quality. But I would suspect since there's no remedial education going, there's a difference in kind between a bachelor's from HYP/Oxbridge and your more typical bachelor's degree.

Students are very high quality at both, but let’s not pretend they are equal: Oxbridge is an order of magnitude easier to get in. This is true in every subject, but since admission is by course, some subjects — say, languages, humanities, social sciences other than Econ — are easier admits than, say, Emory.

[Anonymous]

Oxford and Cambridge expect more work during a shorter time frame. So their terms are 8 wks and you might need to write 12 essays. If you were at a London university for instance, your term could be as long as 12 weeks and you'd only be expected to write 8 essays.
So the pressure is inherent.

[Anonymous]

Really you should compare the last two years at HYP to Oxbridge. The high school systems are also different.

[Anonymous]

The teaching systems are very different. At Oxbridge, you meet in small groups with a tutor, who assigns essays on various works and critiques them. It seems to be a great way to become a good writer. It's very different from the way other British universities teach, because the low student teacher ratio is so expensive.

At Harvard, each class is a combo of large lectures and labs/small group discussions. There are small group seminars, particularly for sophomores, but they would be about 25% of a students courseload.

I taught at a couple of British universities, but we returned home so that my kid could go through the US secondary system. When I was an undergraduate, the courses I took outside of my major really changed the way I look at the world, and my British students didn't have access to that sort of breadth.

The British job market is somewhat more siloed and less flexible than the US market.

[Anonymous]

HYPS have nothing similar to the Tripos.

[Anonymous]

Very different system at Oxford from US. I studied at both. Oxford is very major focused. There are no outside classes, no liberal arts. Lecture and tutorial system. It's also exam based with first year exams and 3rd year exams for final standing.

I like the US system for undergrad and maybe do a 2nd BA at Oxford or Cambridge which will mature to an MA (do they still?).