I wish the moms of the excluding kids could see the emails DD sends me

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why? What do you think they'd do? These kids are friendly enough to your daughter at school. Your daughter even admits that. By 7th grade kids are plenty old enough to choose who they spend their free time with. As long as they're being polite in school there's no problem.

The problem you seem utterly incapable of comprehending is that we have a young girl who is suffering. OP is just looking for some consolation and support. And you come on here with this cold-hearted, useless response.

Why are there always people like you on these threads who come at the OP's question cold-hearted dismissiveness and the worst possible intentions? Are you trying to "educate" OP in the ways of the world. Giving some "tough love". Dismissive people like you and the kids you raise are the problem. NO ONE is saying your kids have to be friends with everyone. NO ONE is saying you can force friendships. But you can teach your kids to look around them and have compassion. To think about how what they do and say affects others. That is all. For Fs sake.

OP is clearly suffering pain that many of us feel when we see our kids in pain or struggling and know that really, our only recourse is to support them. But we can't fix it easily. We can encourage them to find activities where they will find like-minded peers who will accept them. We can listen. But the only way is through.

We don't need thoughtless people like you chiming in.

^^^Could not agree more. And if you cannot be kind, or show grace, just zip it. It's really not that hard.

But, frankly, some of us are capable of teaching our kids to be kind, and inclusive, and not generally exclude ONLY the one kid form outings. Sorry, we do. So it's possible and letting your kid do so just b/c they are "capable of knowing who they want to socialize with" is a cop out and tells me all I need to know about people who say that.

+2

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why? What do you think they'd do? These kids are friendly enough to your daughter at school. Your daughter even admits that. By 7th grade kids are plenty old enough to choose who they spend their free time with. As long as they're being polite in school there's no problem.

The problem you seem utterly incapable of comprehending is that we have a young girl who is suffering. OP is just looking for some consolation and support. And you come on here with this cold-hearted, useless response.

Why are there always people like you on these threads who come at the OP's question cold-hearted dismissiveness and the worst possible intentions? Are you trying to "educate" OP in the ways of the world. Giving some "tough love". Dismissive people like you and the kids you raise are the problem. NO ONE is saying your kids have to be friends with everyone. NO ONE is saying you can force friendships. But you can teach your kids to look around them and have compassion. To think about how what they do and say affects others. That is all. For Fs sake.

OP is clearly suffering pain that many of us feel when we see our kids in pain or struggling and know that really, our only recourse is to support them. But we can't fix it easily. We can encourage them to find activities where they will find like-minded peers who will accept them. We can listen. But the only way is through.

We don't need thoughtless people like you chiming in.

^^^Could not agree more. And if you cannot be kind, or show grace, just zip it. It's really not that hard.

But, frankly, some of us are capable of teaching our kids to be kind, and inclusive, and not generally exclude ONLY the one kid form outings. Sorry, we do. So it's possible and letting your kid do so just b/c they are "capable of knowing who they want to socialize with" is a cop out and tells me all I need to know about people who say that.

Where in the world are you getting this is the ONLY kid excluded? Some of you are just making up your own narrative and running with it.

Of course, that PP was reading into the situation. I cannot decide whether someone is posting to egg everyone on or whether there are decent number of adults who have not gotten over middle school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Op why are you mom-shaming your kids clsssmates’ moms who have little or nothing to do with the social dynamics at the school. You are projecting this attitude to your daughter that she is being mistreated and somehow other moms (not dads apparently) can and should fix this.

Empower your daughter! Help her find her tribe! Insist she try a new club/sport activity every month. Get her involved in extracurricular stuff. See if there are volunteer opportunities at her school. She thinks her world/choices are small and you are reinforcing this. It’s not. Show her how.

This ^^ is important. So many insecure women here, including OP, wanting to excoriate the mothers of girls at OP’s DC’s school as “ mean girls” with nary a word about fathers.

Internalized misogyny and insecurity leaking out all over these other mothers who probably don’t even know OP’s daughter exists.

[Anonymous]

Why can’t she make plans and invite others?

I have a very social 13yo DS. He basically hangs out with the same 2-3 kids. Other times the group may be 5-6 and then at the max 7-8. If your kid is the 9th or 10th kid, she may not get invited.

[Anonymous]

Sorry your DD is going through this OP. It is something a lot of kids go through, but at least your DD still talks to you and seeks you out for comfort.

Count your lucky stars she doesn't have complicating issues like neurodivergence, severe acne, intellectual delays, etc. that would make her targets of outright ridicule. When my kids are down I always tell them to think of how it could be worse. That seems to help them.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Why can’t she make plans and invite others?

I have a very social 13yo DS. He basically hangs out with the same 2-3 kids. Other times the group may be 5-6 and then at the max 7-8. If your kid is the 9th or 10th kid, she may not get invited.

Well, for one thing those other kids are likely to turn her down and then go hang out together without her. Stings more, you know? Sometimes it's better to shield your kids from rejection than to toughen them up by making them put themselves out there, and sometimes it is better to toughen them up than to shield them. Good parents can discern what is the right approach for each situation. Maybe this is a situation where DD needs to be shielded more.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:From some of the responses on this thread, its pretty obvious to see where the mean-girl middle schoolers learned their behavior.

+1

Explain the thought process of wanting the MOTHERS to see these emails. And not, say, the girls themselves? Why is the ire directed at the moms? Hmm?

I have an autistic son who often comes to me with issues like this. One example from this weekend. He has a "friend" who is basically a nice kid but my son finds him annoying. I tell him in no uncertain terms that he is to leave this kid alone. Sometimes he like to "gang up" on the kid because that's what others are doing and I tell him that is not acceptable or nice. Yes, he is in 9th grade but he is probably early middle school maturity wise. You absolutely can talk to your kids about social interactions and I think that's all OP was trying to achieve.

NP. I think there's a pretty big gap between ganging up on someone and just not inviting someone to things. Being nice to people around you is a normal social obligation, but inviting them to hang out isn't.

I agree that I think directing this at the moms is weird. I had zero friends at OP's kid's age (and for half of high school, I didn't see another kid outside of school from 7th grade until the last month of sophomore year), so I have some experience here, and it wasn't the moms fault. It wasn't anyone's fault, it was just a thing that happened. I learned to be happy alone which has served me well throughout my life, so I don't even look back on that time with unhappiness.

But, the other girls are not being inclusive.

Isn’t that bullying?

Uh, no.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Op why are you mom-shaming your kids clsssmates’ moms who have little or nothing to do with the social dynamics at the school. You are projecting this attitude to your daughter that she is being mistreated and somehow other moms (not dads apparently) can and should fix this.

Empower your daughter! Help her find her tribe! Insist she try a new club/sport activity every month. Get her involved in extracurricular stuff. See if there are volunteer opportunities at her school. She thinks her world/choices are small and you are reinforcing this. It’s not. Show her how.

This ^^ is important. So many insecure women here, including OP, wanting to excoriate the mothers of girls at OP’s DC’s school as “ mean girls” with nary a word about fathers.

Internalized misogyny and insecurity leaking out all over these other mothers who probably don’t even know OP’s daughter exists.

Wow this is a big reach and overly harsh. OP is not insecure by anything I see; she is sad. She probably feels a bit powerless. She is enduring that period many of us have endured, usually in MS, when we have to watch our kids struggle with being on the outside for a time. And the truth is, there are limited options to try and help and not do more harm. You can listen, you can encourage, you can assist with helping them find new activities or hosting get togethers. But at the end of the day, by this stage your child has to navigate this. It can be difficult to watch when you love your child and just want to help them feel better.

Some of the advice on here has potential, but you all really need to work on your delivery. You get called mean girls because that is how you sound. Haven't any of you figured out that on a board like this (just like in email or texts) tone can get lost and you have to watch your words.

And to the PP just above me: Are you the poster who comes on to every single one of these threads were people talk about feeling excluded and go on and on about how calling out mean girls/moms is misogyny. Sometimes people invoke that term when it does not apply, but there are mean girls and mean moms and we've all seen it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Op why are you mom-shaming your kids clsssmates’ moms who have little or nothing to do with the social dynamics at the school. You are projecting this attitude to your daughter that she is being mistreated and somehow other moms (not dads apparently) can and should fix this.

Empower your daughter! Help her find her tribe! Insist she try a new club/sport activity every month. Get her involved in extracurricular stuff. See if there are volunteer opportunities at her school. She thinks her world/choices are small and you are reinforcing this. It’s not. Show her how.

This ^^ is important. So many insecure women here, including OP, wanting to excoriate the mothers of girls at OP’s DC’s school as “ mean girls” with nary a word about fathers.

Internalized misogyny and insecurity leaking out all over these other mothers who probably don’t even know OP’s daughter exists.

Wow this is a big reach and overly harsh. OP is not insecure by anything I see; she is sad. She probably feels a bit powerless. She is enduring that period many of us have endured, usually in MS, when we have to watch our kids struggle with being on the outside for a time. And the truth is, there are limited options to try and help and not do more harm. You can listen, you can encourage, you can assist with helping them find new activities or hosting get togethers. But at the end of the day, by this stage your child has to navigate this. It can be difficult to watch when you love your child and just want to help them feel better.

Some of the advice on here has potential, but you all really need to work on your delivery. You get called mean girls because that is how you sound. Haven't any of you figured out that on a board like this (just like in email or texts) tone can get lost and you have to watch your words.

And to the PP just above me: Are you the poster who comes on to every single one of these threads were people talk about feeling excluded and go on and on about how calling out mean girls/moms is misogyny. Sometimes people invoke that term when it does not apply, but there are mean girls and mean moms and we've all seen it.

Not either of the PPs but this thread, like the other exclusion one recently, really gets off on the wrong foot. Why can't people just talk about their feeling without throwing other women under the bus? In the winery exclusion it was "hey everyone! Gather round and tell your tales of other mean women" and in this one it's "let's shame the mothers!" Jesus. Just talk about your daughter's problems and ask for ideas on how to make things better or easier for her or what worked for others. No need to drag other people into it in order to make yourself feel better. Getting the school counselor involved would be far more beneficial than some revenge fantasy of trying to make the other mothers feel shame about what their daughters are supposedly doing. In actuality the girls sound decent anyway, so what would be the point?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Tell her to stop emailing you and stop chasing people who don't want to be her friends. Tell her to focus on other people who she's possibly ignoring while she's paying attention to these kids who don't include her in their weekend plans.

She’s tried several other groups. At least this group talks to her at school.

Op, we moved our DD to another school when this became too much. Outside interests just tore her away from her daily social circle and while she had friends within her teammates we were concerned about her daily social life and maturity at school. It was a process but she did quite well socially in middle school once we moved her and I think God I did not listen to my friends telling me this is just middle school. No, it is little girls being queen bees and their parents do not give two seconds thoughts about it, instead addressing it as normal teen behavior. Good luck.

OP here. What kind of switch did you make? Another public school? A private school? Did you move? We have considered applying to have her moved within our county as that is allowed here if the receiving school has space.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why can’t she make plans and invite others?

I have a very social 13yo DS. He basically hangs out with the same 2-3 kids. Other times the group may be 5-6 and then at the max 7-8. If your kid is the 9th or 10th kid, she may not get invited.

Well, for one thing those other kids are likely to turn her down and then go hang out together without her. Stings more, you know? Sometimes it's better to shield your kids from rejection than to toughen them up by making them put themselves out there, and sometimes it is better to toughen them up than to shield them. Good parents can discern what is the right approach for each situation. Maybe this is a situation where DD needs to be shielded more.

Pp here. DS usually hangs out with the same 2-8 people but then occasionally a non core friend asks him to do something and he will go. I don’t think he ever says no to hanging out.

When he was 11-12, the non core friend parents would text me to set up play dates and he was always down. Since middle school, I have not been involved. I will text other parents to coordinate rides but generally the kids all make the plans by themselves.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Tell her to stop emailing you and stop chasing people who don't want to be her friends. Tell her to focus on other people who she's possibly ignoring while she's paying attention to these kids who don't include her in their weekend plans.

This.
It’s harsh but tbh you need to counsel your daughter not only about her own worth and not “chasing” the people who are excluding her, but also teach her how to channel what she’s feeling to become someone else’s hero in this same story.
Chances are, if your DD is “on the fringe” of being treated “nice enough” by the cool crowd but just not quite “in” with them enough to be included, she’s probably not really friends with them.
And instead of trying to dissect why or jockey to score the pity-invite, please help her channel this into being a blessing to some other girl who is “nice and normal but maybe forgotten” whose mom may be experiencing these same emails from
her DD.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Tell her to stop emailing you and stop chasing people who don't want to be her friends. Tell her to focus on other people who she's possibly ignoring while she's paying attention to these kids who don't include her in their weekend plans.

She’s tried several other groups. At least this group talks to her at school.

Op, we moved our DD to another school when this became too much. Outside interests just tore her away from her daily social circle and while she had friends within her teammates we were concerned about her daily social life and maturity at school. It was a process but she did quite well socially in middle school once we moved her and I think God I did not listen to my friends telling me this is just middle school. No, it is little girls being queen bees and their parents do not give two seconds thoughts about it, instead addressing it as normal teen behavior. Good luck.

OP here. What kind of switch did you make? Another public school? A private school? Did you move? We have considered applying to have her moved within our county as that is allowed here if the receiving school has space.

+1 for the total switch, OP.

Get her into a private or some sort of magnet or academy within the district if you need to.
This will give her a fresh start and it sounds like she mostly needs that more than anything else.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why can’t she make plans and invite others?

I have a very social 13yo DS. He basically hangs out with the same 2-3 kids. Other times the group may be 5-6 and then at the max 7-8. If your kid is the 9th or 10th kid, she may not get invited.

Well, for one thing those other kids are likely to turn her down and then go hang out together without her. Stings more, you know? Sometimes it's better to shield your kids from rejection than to toughen them up by making them put themselves out there, and sometimes it is better to toughen them up than to shield them. Good parents can discern what is the right approach for each situation. Maybe this is a situation where DD needs to be shielded more.

Pp here. DS usually hangs out with the same 2-8 people but then occasionally a non core friend asks him to do something and he will go. I don’t think he ever says no to hanging out.

When he was 11-12, the non core friend parents would text me to set up play dates and he was always down. Since middle school, I have not been involved. I will text other parents to coordinate rides but generally the kids all make the plans by themselves.

I know that—being a mom—you are aware of this already. But I feel like it needs to be emphasized that….girls are very different in their social dynamics and how they express inclusion vs exclusion.
So while your boy-story is interesting. It really isn’t relevant to OP.

[Anonymous]

Not being invited does not mean exclusion. I say this as a mom of the kid not invited to a lot of things.

Middles school is tough socially. The social circles shift, and some kids are left out for awhile. But the answer is not continue to invite everyone to everything, that is impossible as you see different kids in different classes. The answer is find your friends. It can take awhile. It can be painful to watch. But you need to teach resilience, not whine and blame everyone else.

Also OP - you have a very biased view of the situation. It sounds like there is a core group of friends, and instead of them being exclusive, they are being nice to your kid at school. Do you really think they should be mean?